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  1. #1
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    Does the Number 318 in Exodus 14:14 prove gematria was being used?

    Quote Originally Posted by thebluetriangle View Post
    , the spelling of the words used in the text was already fixed by the time it was written, a time when alphabetic numeration was unknown to the writers.
    Genesis 14:14 proves otherwise

    And Abram heard that his kinsman had been taken captive, and he armed his trained men, those born in his house, three hundred and eighteen, and he pursued [them] until Dan.



    318 being numerical value of the name Eliezer

    Genesis 15:2,
    And Abram said, "O Lord God, what will You give me, since I am going childless, and the steward of my household is Eliezer of Damascus?"

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    Genesis 14:14 proves otherwise

    And Abram heard that his kinsman had been taken captive, and he armed his trained men, those born in his house, three hundred and eighteen, and he pursued [them] until Dan.



    318 being numerical value of the name Eliezer

    Genesis 15:2,
    And Abram said, "O Lord God, what will You give me, since I am going childless, and the steward of my household is Eliezer of Damascus?"
    How does that single coincidence prove anything?
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    How does that single coincidence prove anything?
    318 is also gematria of "siach" = bush, shrub; conversation, talk; meditation

    in Genesis 2:5

    וְכֹ֣ל שִׂ֣יחַ הַשָּׂדֶ֗ה טֶ֚רֶם יִֽהְיֶ֣ה בָאָ֔רֶץ and every bush of the field when it was not yet in the earth


    same earth that was mentioned in Genesis 1:1

    it needed the mist, "ed", of Genesis 2:6 to give drink to the entire surface of the ground.

    giving drink = "shakah", rootletters "shin- kof", that are also in "ben- meshek beiti", steward of my houshold, and "d'meshek", Damascus ( explained as "the one who drew and gave to drink from his master's teachings to others.) in Genesis 15:2

    so that proves it is not mere coincidence

    Mist "ed" is written "alef-dalet" = "1-4" -- source of the 1:4 ratio of the two trees.

    But of course it was written by God,
    or better dictated by God and written down by Moses
    Last edited by sylvius; 08-19-2019 at 10:30 PM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    or better dictated by God and written down by Moses
    But who was Moses?

    He was born in a world where all new born baby boys had to be thrown into the Nile ( the river ) = into oblivion

    (since "zachar" , male, is related to "zachar" = to remember)

    Exodus 1:22, And Pharaoh commanded all his people, saying, "Every son who is born you shall cast into the Nile, and every daughter you shall allow to live."



    His name is declared as, Exodus 2:10, "ki min-hamayim mishiteihu"
    "For I drew him from the water."

    cf. John 21:11, Simon Peter went up and drew the net to land, full of large fish

    "mosheh"= 345 = reversed "hashem"= the (essential) name.

    To Moses God revealed his name at the burning bush

    bush סְּנֶֽה is another name for שִׂ֣יחַ in Genesis 2:5

    etc., etc.

    John 1:17,
    For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

    https://twitter.com/Minkmaat/status/989778752543641600
    Last edited by sylvius; 08-20-2019 at 01:34 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    How does that single coincidence prove anything?
    footnote in KBS-bible (catholic) placed by my teacher Pater Nelis, for which he was reprimanded by the bishop.

    https://twitter.com/Minkmaat/status/1163780340281991168


    footnote in NBG-bible (protestant):

    https://twitter.com/Minkmaat/status/1163781692433346562


    So that means war


    War of the four kings (the squareheads) against the five.

    First war mentioned --Mother Of All Wars

  6. #6
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    ha ha , there you have it:

    https://messianic-revolution.com/14-...t-one-servant/

    Alex says

    March 5, 2018 at 8:00 pm

    So many people try to find numeric meaning without knowing the truth or the history of the one, holy and apostolic Church - Orthodox Christianity.

    For us it's simple. 318 holy fathers gathered at the first Ecumenical Council in Nicea (that condemned the heresies of the time) therefore defeating the enemy (satan that works through heretics). Just as Abraam defeated the earthly enemies with 318 men.




    richoka says

    March 6, 2018 at 3:16 am

    Thanks for sharing Alex but I don't know if I can accept your theory. The Ecumenical Council in Nicea?! Isn't that the anti-semitical group that established the ridiculous "trinity" idea?

    https://books.google.nl/books?id=P2R...4%3A14&f=false

  7. #7
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    Excellent example sylvius!

    Every person sees their own doctrines in the numbers. The numbers don't actually have any meaning in themselves.

    They are like a Rorschach test.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Excellent example sylvius!

    Every person sees their own doctrines in the numbers. The numbers don't actually have any meaning in themselves.

    They are like a Rorschach test.

    You seemingly forgot already that it was about the fact that the author(s) of Genesis apparently knew about the numerical values of letters, words and phrases, so that they deliberately might have worded Genesis 1:1 in such way that the numerical values of the letters summed up to 2701, etc.


    (They must have been very high anyway)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    You seemingly forgot already that it was about the fact that the author(s) of Genesis apparently knew about the numerical values of letters, words and phrases, so that they deliberately might have worded Genesis 1:1 in such way that the numerical values of the letters summed up to 2701, etc.


    (They must have been very high anyway)
    Why would you think I forgot that? I asked you why anyone would think a single trivial little coincidence like the value of 318 in Exodus 14:14 would prove anything and you apparently "forgot" to answer.

    So answer me this. Given that there are so many words and numbers in the Bible, it seems very likely that we would find random coincidences like this. Why would you think the example of 318 is not one of those random coincidences? And how could anyone know if it were?

    Back in the day when I was a believer, I took the fact that Paul linked the number 430 with the law as evidence of gematria because the Greek nomos (law) = 430.

    Gal 3:17 What I am saying is this: the Law (= 430), which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise.

    Do you think this is evidence that Paul was using Greek gematria?
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Why would you think I forgot that? I asked you why anyone would think a single trivial little coincidence like the value of 318 in Exodus 14:14 would prove anything and you apparently "forgot" to answer.
    it's not a single trivial coincidence
    So answer me this. Given that there are so many words and numbers in the Bible, it seems very likely that we would find random coincidences like this. Why would you think the example of 318 is not one of those random coincidences? And how could anyone know if it were?
    it's no coincidence, but deliberately written that way.


    Back in the day when I was a believer, I took the fact that Paul linked the number 430 with the law as evidence of gematria because the Greek nomos (law) = 430.

    Gal 3:17 What I am saying is this: the Law (= 430), which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise.

    Do you think this is evidence that Paul was using Greek gematria?
    It proves that Paul knew that "the covenant between the parts" (Genesis 15) took place when Abra(ha)m was 70 years old, so five years before he left Charan.

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