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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Yakima, Wa
    Posts
    15,146

    Hey ho! We're back online after a server crash.

    On February 17, 2017, the server hosting this site crashed. Unfortunately, my hosting company said they could not provide any backups because all of them, from the beginning of time, had somehow become corrupted. Luckily, I had made my own backup on November 30, 2014 so not all was lost. Unfortunately, we have lost the last two years of posts. But not necessarily, because many of those posts can still be found on search engines. I encourage anyone who thinks they have written a valuable post to find it on Google and copy/paste into a new post so your work will not be lost.

    I have moved the site to a new host, LiquidWeb.com. They have an excellent set up, very responsive and helpful. This site is now hosted on a Virtual Private Server (VPS) and so should be much more robust.

    Please let me know if you see any anomalies in the site so I can fix them.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    776
    Thanks for all your hard work, Richard.

    I was concerned you had started to deconstruct the site without warning us!
    16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; 17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; 19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

    Ephesians 3

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Yakima, Wa
    Posts
    15,146
    Quote Originally Posted by Charisma View Post
    Thanks for all your hard work, Richard.
    I was concerned you had started to deconstruct the site without warning us!
    You are most welcome Charisma!

    Don't worry about me ever taking down the site. It is a very valuable archive of thousands of discussions with lots of research and insight. And it records how we have all changed and/or stayed the same over many years. It's like a public diary that is particularly significant to me because it records my transition from Christian to atheist.

    Talk more soon.

    Richard

    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    274
    Hi Richard,
    It's good to see the forum back up again. I checked every dew days for a while and then got my hopes up when I saw your post from the 6th where you expected the forum to be back up the next day. When it didn't happen I figured something more serious went wrong and figured it would be a while til the forum was back, if ever. In a smaller way, I and many others who have posted here shared in the experience of feeling loss and recognizing the transient nature of the things that have meaning to us. It is kind of strange, I was going to mention a couple of books I just finished reading in the "Book Review" section when the site went down. They are "Escape From Evil" and "The Birth and Death of Meaning" by Ernest Becker. They both deal a lot with the kind of structures and strategies us humans develop to cope with the tension that we, as self-conscious beings, have to endure from an early age. The tension between sharing in the seemingly universal desire of all life forms to continue and expand their experience of existence on the one hand, and our realization that this desire is going to fail on the other. He used metaphors similar to yours about walking the razor's edge, like "standing naked in the face of the howling winds of reality" (that's a paraphrase) and several others I can't recall right now. When I was younger, I remember hearing about Mr. Becker one time in a short T.V. segment when they described how he had pulled together research from a lot of psychology and anthropology experts, and articulated a theory on the basis of human motivation to replace Freud's sexual/reproduction model. He saw our basic drive in life as an attempt to find some enduring meaning for our existence. Other than that one T.V. segment I haven't heard a peep, which isn't surprising, since he deals with a subject that calls all of our social structures into question. The only social structure he found in history that was a "beautiful and elegant" solution to man's dilemma was "primitive Christianity", but he was disappointed because this system relied on faith in a life after this one and there was no empirical way to prove its claims. This reliance on another life to come kind of dovetails with something Iain McGilchrist mentioned in his book on "the divided brain". Some things cannot be pursued and achieved directly without destroying what you are after. People want to focus on this world and try to make it better, which is natural. But it may be counter-productive in that "reality" can be extremely frustrating and elusive, and sometimes solutions end up being worse than the original problem. People finding meaning for their existence in a future life can absorb things that otherwise would start an escalating chain reaction.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Yakima, Wa
    Posts
    15,146
    Quote Originally Posted by Silence View Post
    Hi Richard,
    It's good to see the forum back up again. I checked every dew days for a while and then got my hopes up when I saw your post from the 6th where you expected the forum to be back up the next day. When it didn't happen I figured something more serious went wrong and figured it would be a while til the forum was back, if ever. In a smaller way, I and many others who have posted here shared in the experience of feeling loss and recognizing the transient nature of the things that have meaning to us. It is kind of strange, I was going to mention a couple of books I just finished reading in the "Book Review" section when the site went down. They are "Escape From Evil" and "The Birth and Death of Meaning" by Ernest Becker. They both deal a lot with the kind of structures and strategies us humans develop to cope with the tension that we, as self-conscious beings, have to endure from an early age. The tension between sharing in the seemingly universal desire of all life forms to continue and expand their experience of existence on the one hand, and our realization that this desire is going to fail on the other. He used metaphors similar to yours about walking the razor's edge, like "standing naked in the face of the howling winds of reality" (that's a paraphrase) and several others I can't recall right now. When I was younger, I remember hearing about Mr. Becker one time in a short T.V. segment when they described how he had pulled together research from a lot of psychology and anthropology experts, and articulated a theory on the basis of human motivation to replace Freud's sexual/reproduction model. He saw our basic drive in life as an attempt to find some enduring meaning for our existence. Other than that one T.V. segment I haven't heard a peep, which isn't surprising, since he deals with a subject that calls all of our social structures into question. The only social structure he found in history that was a "beautiful and elegant" solution to man's dilemma was "primitive Christianity", but he was disappointed because this system relied on faith in a life after this one and there was no empirical way to prove its claims. This reliance on another life to come kind of dovetails with something Iain McGilchrist mentioned in his book on "the divided brain". Some things cannot be pursued and achieved directly without destroying what you are after. People want to focus on this world and try to make it better, which is natural. But it may be counter-productive in that "reality" can be extremely frustrating and elusive, and sometimes solutions end up being worse than the original problem. People finding meaning for their existence in a future life can absorb things that otherwise would start an escalating chain reaction.
    Hey there Silence,

    I'm so glad you found your way back! Very interesting insights. We have a similar taste in books. I've read Becker and McGilchrist. I agree with Becker that Christianity (primitive or not) is an "elegant solution" - it has excellent symbols that naturally resonate with the human experience, and it appeals to some very "primitive" (or perhaps archetypal) aspects of humanity. But I also agree that believing in a future life is not justified, not merely because of a lack of empirical evidence, but also because a lack of plausibility. We are physical organisms. Our consciousness appears to be a product of our brains. This is not necessarily a death knell for Christianity because our resurrection (which seems more like a re-creation since the old body typically is annihilated) means that we would be physical. This is the interpretation take by "physicalist" Christians who believe we are nothing more than our bodies, and that's why we need to be resurrected (as opposed to living forever in "spirit" form). But none of this seems plausible to me at this time.

    Well, I have a lot more to say, but I gotta get to work.

    Great chatting!

    Shine on!

    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    666
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    On February 17, 2017, the server hosting this site crashed. Unfortunately, my hosting company said they could not provide any backups because all of them, from the beginning of time, had somehow become corrupted. Luckily, I had made my own backup on November 30, 2014 so not all was lost. Unfortunately, we have lost the last two years of posts. But not necessarily, because many of those posts can still be found on search engines. I encourage anyone who thinks they have written a valuable post to find it on Google and copy/paste into a new post so your work will not be lost.

    I have moved the site to a new host, LiquidWeb.com. They have an excellent set up, very responsive and helpful. This site is now hosted on a Virtual Private Server (VPS) and so should be much more robust.

    Please let me know if you see any anomalies in the site so I can fix them.
    Hey Richard,


    Thanks for the heads up that the forum is back up. It's good to be back. It's a total bummer that you lost two years worth of posts. There were some pretty memorable posts during that time. Oh well... we'll just have to make new ones. There is always much to discuss since the world changes at such a rapid pace. Especially as it pertains to Don the Con.

    Btw, you can call me Justin. I have been called L67 for so long that it never occurred to me to go by my real name on this forum. Better late than never I guess.

    Talk more later.
    When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace - Jimi Hendrix


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Yakima, Wa
    Posts
    15,146
    Quote Originally Posted by L67 View Post
    Hey Richard,


    Thanks for the heads up that the forum is back up. It's good to be back. It's a total bummer that you lost two years worth of posts. There were some pretty memorable posts during that time. Oh well... we'll just have to make new ones. There is always much to discuss since the world changes at such a rapid pace. Especially as it pertains to Don the Con.

    Btw, you can call me Justin. I have been called L67 for so long that it never occurred to me to go by my real name on this forum. Better late than never I guess.

    Talk more later.
    Hey there Justin, it's great to meet you!

    There's still a faint hope of recovering all the posts, but it doesn't look good. Every time I call my old host they always say they expect to have the data recovered in just a few hours ... they've given me that answer at at least four times in the last month!

    Also, if you have any particularly memorable posts in mind, you may be able to find them on Google or Bing. But that gets less likely as every day passes because they clear their caches rather frequently.

    As for #DonTheCon - I'm sure that fraud will continue to be a fount of absurdity till the day he is impeached. So we'll have no shortage of material there. I think it would be good to start a thread to his lies. He is the most outrageously brazen lying conman ever to sit as POTUS. I call him #BLOTUS = Biggest Liar of The United States.

    It's good to have you back my friend! Talk more soon.

    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  8. #8
    Unregistered Guest

    Can't log in

    Hi Richard, I haven't been able to log in. I thought I had the right password but maybe not. I'm even having trouble with the verification code not taking. Should I re-register?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Yakima, Wa
    Posts
    15,146
    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    Hi Richard, I haven't been able to log in. I thought I had the right password but maybe not. I'm even having trouble with the verification code not taking. Should I re-register?
    No need to re-register. Just send me your user name in an email and I will reply with a temporary password.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

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