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  1. #1

    Three Days and Three Nights

    Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a “discussion” with 6th day crucifixion proponents, they frequently argue that it is a Jewish idiom for counting any part of a day as a whole day. I wonder if anyone has documentation that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least a part of each one of the specific number of days and at least a part of each one of the specific number of nights?
    Last edited by rstrats; 06-07-2017 at 01:24 PM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by rstrats View Post
    Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a “discussion” with 6th day crucifixion proponents, they frequently argue that it is a Jewish idiom for counting any part of a day as a whole day. I wonder if anyone has documentation that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least a part of each one of the specific number of days and at least a part of each one of the specific number of nights?
    Hey there rstrats,

    Welcome to our forum!



    That's a good question. I've never seen any evidence either way. Other than the death and resurrection of Christ, all the references in the Bible that state the time as "x days and x nights" give no additional information that would indicate the actual amount of time. So there is no way to confirm that assertion from the Bible.

    I find it very strange that interpreters are so willing to declare a "Jewish idiom" without providing any evidence of their assertion.

    Thanks for the interesting question.

    Richard
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Hey there rstrats,

    Welcome to our forum!



    That's a good question. I've never seen any evidence either way. Other than the death and resurrection of Christ, all the references in the Bible that state the time as "x days and x nights" give no additional information that would indicate the actual amount of time. So there is no way to confirm that assertion from the Bible.

    I find it very strange that interpreters are so willing to declare a "Jewish idiom" without providing any evidence of their assertion.

    Thanks for the interesting question.

    Richard
    Matthew 12:40
    For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.The April full moon peaks (April 11)2017 Pesach day 1 (Passover) 04/12/2017
    Passover day II 04/13/2017
    Passover day III at sundown starting the Sabbath Jesus was resurrected, the world will be Mourning the Death of Jesus on the day of the resurrection.
    Daniel25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

  4. #4
    The Messiah said that 3 night times would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth". However, there are those who believe that the Messiah died on the 6th day of the week and who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the time between the leaving of His spirit from His body and His resurrection on the 1st day of the week. But this belief allows for only 2 night times to be involved. To reconcile this discrepancy some say that the Messiah was using common Jewish figure of speech/colloquial language. I am simply asking for examples to support that assertion of commonality; i.e., examples where a daytime or a night time was forecast to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rstrats View Post
    The Messiah said that 3 night times would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth". However, there are those who believe that the Messiah died on the 6th day of the week and who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the time between the leaving of His spirit from His body and His resurrection on the 1st day of the week. But this belief allows for only 2 night times to be involved. To reconcile this discrepancy some say that the Messiah was using common Jewish figure of speech/colloquial language. I am simply asking for examples to support that assertion of commonality; i.e., examples where a daytime or a night time was forecast to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred.

    Do you think Jonah was a literal three days and three nights in the (literal) belly of a (literal) fish?

    For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

    ὥσπερ γὰρ ἦν Ἰωνᾶς ἐν τῇ κοιλίᾳ τοῦ κήτους τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτας, οὕτως ἔσται ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ ἀνθρώπου ἐν τῇ καρδίᾳ τῆς γῆς τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτας

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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    Do you think Jonah was a literal three days and three nights in the (literal) belly of a (literal) fish?

    For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

    ὥσπερ γὰρ ἦν Ἰωνᾶς ἐν τῇ κοιλίᾳ τοῦ κήτους τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτας, οὕτως ἔσται ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ ἀνθρώπου ἐν τῇ καρδίᾳ τῆς γῆς τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτας
    Jonah 2:1,

    And the Lord appointed a huge fish to swallow up Jonah, and Jonah was in the belly of the fish for three days and three nights.


    huge fish = "dag gadol"

    LXX has κῆτος = whale

    καὶ προσέταξεν κύριος κήτει μεγάλῳ καταπιεῖν τὸν Iωναν καὶ ἦν Iωνας ἐν τῇ κοιλίᾳ τοῦ κήτους τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτας


    So Matthew 12:40 is after LXX,
    ὥσπερ γὰρ ἦν Ἰωνᾶς ἐν τῇ κοιλίᾳ τοῦ κήτους τρεῖς ἡμέρας καὶ τρεῖς νύκτα

    But Greek for Hebrew "dag" is ἰχθύς

    whale = Hebrew "livyatan"


    cf. John 21:11 speaks of "huge fishes"

    ἀνέβη οὖν Σίμων Πέτρος καὶ εἵλκυσεν τὸ δίκτυον εἰς τὴν γῆν μεστὸν ἰχθύων μεγάλων ἑκατὸν πεντήκοντα τριῶν

    Fishes of the kind that swallowed Jonah?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by rstrats View Post
    Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a “discussion” with 6th day crucifixion proponents, they frequently argue that it is a Jewish idiom for counting any part of a day as a whole day. I wonder if anyone has documentation that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least a part of each one of the specific number of days and at least a part of each one of the specific number of nights?

    You asked the same on Theologyweb:

    http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...73#post3588673

    My answer there:


    A common misconception is that Jesus should have been resurrected on the first day of the week (Sunday).

    It is in no place written that way.

    Just that on the first of the week the grave was found to be empty.

    So the "three days and three nights", or the "after three days", or the "on the third day" might allude to something else.

    I do want to contend that it alludes to the third day of creation, the day of the double "ki-tov", the two times "and God saw that it was good", where the "tov" in Genesis 1:12 is the 153rd word from the beginning.

    The first "tov" in the Bible is to be found in Genesis 1:4, "and God saw the light that it was good", the light that was obscured because of Adam's sin.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    I do want to contend that it alludes to the third day of creation, the day of the double "ki-tov", the two times "and God saw that it was good", where the "tov" in Genesis 1:12 is the 153rd word from the beginning.
    Is there any way for anyone to know if your contention is true or not?

    And if it is true, what does it matter? Why would it be important to know such a thing?
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Is there any way for anyone to know if your contention is true or not?

    And if it is true, what does it matter? Why would it be important to know such a thing?
    It was about the resurrection "after three days" or "on the third day".

    Death is there becuase of sin, death and sin belong together, even like pain and pleasure, "nega" and "oneg", both with gematria 123, a permutation of 231, i,e. bound to your wheel with the 22 spokes and the 231 gates.
    http://www.biblewheel.com/Wheel/231Gates.php



    Maybe you should burn a good incense to perceive ...

    Exodus 30:37,

    And the incense that you make, you shall not make for yourselves according to its formula; it shall be holy to you for the Lord.



    (The lord whose name is in the initial letters of "yom hashishi vay'chulu hashamayim")

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by sylvius View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Is there any way for anyone to know if your contention is true or not?

    And if it is true, what does it matter? Why would it be important to know such a thing?
    It was about the resurrection "after three days" or "on the third day".

    Death is there becuase of sin, death and sin belong together, even like pain and pleasure, "nega" and "oneg", both with gematria 123, a permutation of 231, i,e. bound to your wheel with the 22 spokes and the 231 gates.
    http://www.biblewheel.com/Wheel/231Gates.php



    Maybe you should burn a good incense to perceive ...

    Exodus 30:37,

    And the incense that you make, you shall not make for yourselves according to its formula; it shall be holy to you for the Lord.



    (The lord whose name is in the initial letters of "yom hashishi vay'chulu hashamayim"))
    You didn't even try to answer my question.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

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