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  1. #1

    hebrew have ownership (apostrophe s)?

    in answering who is YESHUA'S FATHER:

    yeshua's abba ?

    or yeshua abba?

    which is correct ownership in hebrew?

    thanks a bunch : )

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClockNumerology View Post
    in answering who is YESHUA'S FATHER:

    yeshua's abba ?

    or yeshua abba?

    which is correct ownership in hebrew?

    thanks a bunch : )
    It's a play on words that only those who read Hebrew do see.
    Consider who was released from crucifixion in exchange for Yeshua Ha'Masciach

    To correctly state ownwership of this nature, there is no apostrophe; but there is an additional word.

    It is [Ye(hosh)ua(h) BAR ABBA[s]] [(in Aramaic)] and Hebrew.

    Yeshua Barabba and in English this is translated as Jesus Barabbas.


    Tim Timmy Tim Tim


    Timmy
    Last edited by Timmy; 01-16-2012 at 04:49 PM.
    The mind grows by taking in
    :Mesiras Nefesh:
    THE HEART GROWS BY GIVING OUT

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClockNumerology View Post
    in answering who is YESHUA'S FATHER:

    yeshua's abba ?

    or yeshua abba?

    which is correct ownership in hebrew?

    thanks a bunch : )
    In Biblical Hebrew, the possessive is indicated by the construct state where one word just follows another, like Bet Yahweh (House of the Lord, or Lord's house). The construct state often includes a small change of pronunciations and/or the addition of a letter. Case in point, Father of Yeshua or Yeshua's Father is written avi Yeshua.

    Note, in Biblical Hebrew the word Father is spelled Av (Aleph Bet) not Abba (Aleph Bet Aleph). That form entered Hebrew after the Bible was finished.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    In Biblical Hebrew, the possessive is indicated by the construct state where one word just follows another, like Bet Yahweh (House of the Lord, or Lord's house). The construct state often includes a small change of pronunciations and/or the addition of a letter. Case in point, Father of Yeshua or Yeshua's Father is written avi Yeshua.

    Note, in Biblical Hebrew the word Father is spelled Av (Aleph Bet) not Abba (Aleph Bet Aleph). That form entered Hebrew after the Bible was finished.
    ...and if His name were stated where "father" is the possessive noun, it would be Yeshua Ben'abba.
    (for example: Benjamin is English for "son of"(y is silent)amin, Ben'amin.

    Howz dat?

    Tau Timmy Tim Tim
    The mind grows by taking in
    :Mesiras Nefesh:
    THE HEART GROWS BY GIVING OUT

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
    It's a play on words that only those who read Hebrew do see.
    Consider who was released from crucifixion in exchange for Yeshua Ha'Masciach

    To correctly state ownwership of this nature, there is no apostrophe; but there is an additional word.

    It is [Ye(hosh)ua(h) BAR ABBA[s]] [(in Aramaic)] and Hebrew.

    Yeshua Barabba and in English this is translated as Jesus Barabbas.


    Tim Timmy Tim Tim


    Timmy
    Thanks for the info. I knew about Barrabas meaning Bar Abba (son of the father) but I was unaware of (or forgot) that there is a textual variaion in Matthew 27:17 which says that his name as Jesus Barrabas! The NRSV translates it this way:
    NRS Matthew 27:17 So after they had gathered, Pilate said to them, "Whom do you want me to release for you, Jesus Barabbas or Jesus who is called the Messiah?"
    That really amplifies the "word play" between Barrabas and Jesus.

    It seems the translators don't put much weight on this textual variation since most leave it out.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
    ...and if His name were stated where "father" is the possessive noun, it would be Yeshua Ben'abba.
    (for example: Benjamin is English for "son of"(y is silent)amin, Ben'amin.

    Howz dat?

    Tau Timmy Tim Tim
    That's how it would be done in Aramaic. In Biblical Hebrew it would just be Yehoshua Ben Av.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    That's how it would be done in Aramaic. In Biblical Hebrew it would just be Yehoshua Ben Av.
    Yes, thnx for the clarity oh Big Kahuna!

    i was just spoutin' off as is sometimes the case.

    ...oh, and "amin" is "right hand/side" y representing "my" but why?????

    It's thought that the textual variation is due to originating text is more than likely aramaic and as well, the hubbub about Yeshua having the name of that murderer.thief, it became a textual variation...even though the gematria of Netzach plays into that whole scenario beautifully.

    Little Timmy
    The mind grows by taking in
    :Mesiras Nefesh:
    THE HEART GROWS BY GIVING OUT

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
    Yes, thnx for the clarity oh Big Kahuna!

    i was just spoutin' off as is sometimes the case.

    ...oh, and "amin" is "right hand/side" y representing "my" but why?????

    It's thought that the textual variation is due to originating text is more than likely aramaic and as well, the hubbub about Yeshua having the name of that murderer.thief, it became a textual variation...even though the gematria of Netzach plays into that whole scenario beautifully.

    Little Timmy
    You're doing great Timmy Tim Tim! I was just adding my two bits.

    I just looked up "kahuna" - I had no idea what you were calling me. So you think I'm the Big "Priest, sorcerer, magician, wizard, minister, expert in any profession." That's interesting!

    Abara K'Dabara! (I create as I speak)
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    You're doing great Timmy Tim Tim! I was just adding my two bits.

    I just looked up "kahuna" - I had no idea what you were calling me. So you think I'm the Big "Priest, sorcerer, magician, wizard, minister, expert in any profession." That's interesting!

    Abara K'Dabara! (I create as I speak)
    It just struck me that kahuna is Hawaian for "priest" - how did those kohens get to Hawaii?

    Strong's 3548 kohen {ko-hane'}
    Meaning: 1) priest, principal officer or chief ruler 1a) priest-king (Melchizedek, Messiah) 1b) pagan priests 1c) priests of Jehovah 1d) Levitical priests 1e) Zadokite priests 1f) Aaronic priests 1g) the high priest
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    I just looked up "kahuna" - I had no idea what you were calling me. So you think I'm the Big "Priest, sorcerer, magician, wizard, minister, expert in any profession." That's interesting!

    Abara K'Dabara! (I create as I speak)

    Abraxas' cadavers:
    Word like arrows,
    Once from the bow shot,
    To the quiver,
    They return not.

    Yes, that is the intention oh Big Kahuna.
    You know far more than you say.
    You see more clearly than you let on.
    i was once a chemognostically inclined rascal as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    . . .kahuna is Hawaian for "priest" - how did those kohens get to Hawaii?

    Strong's 3548 kohen {ko-hane'}
    Meaning: 1) priest, principal officer or chief ruler 1a) priest-king (Melchizedek, Messiah) 1b) pagan priests 1c) priests of Jehovah 1d) Levitical priests 1e) Zadokite priests 1f) Aaronic priests 1g) the high priest
    That one just klunked me in the head like a lead balloon bro!

    i know what it is...is meant: the why of why those two relative words were nary compared etymologically for spermology:
    When using English, which is usually the case, priest is written as cohen. Even though it is pronounced as a hard consonant k sound, i utterly failed to even recognize that window you just opened

    Thanks for that. Sound like an archeological dig is in order; but how much lava and pumice needs to be picked away and shoveled through to get down to these roots of Hawiian religious origins?

    Oh, and you did do more than add two bits. Abba is equivalent to the English word "daddy/dad" and children (no matter what age) use it just like kids use dad and daddy in Amerika:terms of endearment. Avi is really moreso appropriatlry equivalent to father.

    Waka waka,

    Timmy

    p.s. Are you familiar with Anton Sanzor LaVey's notions about erotic crystalization inertia? If not, think about those jokers in the nursing homes who are reliving bygone days and you can understand a bit of what he is talking about.

    i can now honestly say i am more than half-a-century old. Looking back, so many things done and gone now seem so rediculously ironicalicious.
    It has never been desired to wear pants hanging down to the ground
    --Did you know that this 'fashion statement' began as a male prison populations signal expressing need for a new beau to drop the soap for?--
    or though highly capable in ebonic linguistic avoid it altogether.
    --Or did you know the almost lost slang term 'honky" evolved in NYC in the 60's by black folk mocking the nasal tone of speech by whitey?--
    My wife is black and now tells me that there are just some things middle aged white men should not be allowed to do; but it is more than obviously evident it is just me she is referring to (as that certain laugh she has reserved for yours truly whenever she is laughing at me and not with me.)

    i think i'll make some leather sandals, gird my loins in camel pelt, then locate an almond or hazel staff. i can live off of honey and its locust out in the wilderness by the Yarden River. There i can holler like a man deranged all about what God tells me to say next.

    If not, give me about 15 years and i will be able to enter a restaurant and be priveledged enough to recieve my very first senior coffee...though they will more than more than likely ask for an I.D. when requesting that senior discount. The HGH(Human Growth Hormone) does amazing wonders vitamins could never do.
    Last edited by Timmy; 01-17-2012 at 06:18 AM.
    The mind grows by taking in
    :Mesiras Nefesh:
    THE HEART GROWS BY GIVING OUT

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