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  1. #241
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    Hey there my friend!

    What do you imagine "being back with God" would entail? How would that work? We both know that belief in God is indistinguishable from a total delusion. So what exactly are you hoping to see? How would it change anything?
    Is it a "fact" that belief in God (or any god) is delusional? Wouldn't that be merely an opinion based on your own personal feelings? Faith is the belief in what we do not always see. And I for one do believe in God. My life is not a direct reflection of his righteousness, but I do believe. With so many Old Testament prophesies being proven, in such a long span of time, I'd say something has to be right. You certainly don't see the kinds of witnesses found throughout history in other religions compared to Christianity. But even if you should continue in disbelief or rejection, certainly doesn't warrant any ridicule from those who believe. Wouldn't you agree?

    Everyone who believes in God makes up their own religion or blindly believes what someone else told them from either a pulpit or a book. I see no reason to believe any of it. Do you?
    I understand this position, and I know that I am no better than those who do not believe. But my heart tells me there is much more to life than obeying governments, paying bills, and mowing the lawn.

    That's the real question Joe. What do you mean when you say you believe in God? Can anyone trust God to do anything for anyone in any situation in this life? Nope. This means that the core Christian assertion that "God is trustworthy" is demonstrably false, and should not be believed.
    I believe God has already done all that is necessary. I do not believe that God is up there waiting for people to pray to Him so he can answer their prayers. One of the sacrifices or costs associated with "free choice" is also "personal responsibility". I suppose I'd rather believe in a God that permits us to make mistakes, learn from them, and move on from there, as opposed to relying on a God or god to solve every problem for us. At the same time, I hope and pray for his protection.

    If the "Jewish Illuminati" are so powerful, how did you find out about them?
    I do not necessarily call them "illuminati"; I simply call them Jews. But to answer your question, I have a friend in Wisconsin who was once part of the Illuminati. I have also been approached by a local free-mason (of the Illuminati) who has tried to invite me into the group; I still have his card. They call themselves, "Anglo Saxon Jews" for Christ. The problem is this cult has so many different levels and divisions that identifying them is very difficult. After speaking to one of my "Intelligence" buddies the card this group gave to me, he warned me to stay away from them as they were being monitored. What concerned me the most was the older gentlemen in the group was a retired local Sheriff. My friend in Wisconsin told me that one of the ways this massive global group maintains their realm of influence is by running for key positions of local power, to even Federal power. He also told me that they rely heavily on gaining access to law enforcement agencies which allows them to spread even further. Needless to say, I hopped on my motorcycle and left. They wanted me to join their group, ride in their bike club, and participate in late night bomb-fires. Needless to say, movies had me nervous. For all I know, they are a great bunch of people. But then again, I didn't want to take that chance. I still have the card if you'd like me to send you a copy of it. The front of the card has the Illuminati symbol, with his name and company. The back of the card had numbers stacked like a pyramid.

    How do you distinguish between lunatic ravings and the conspiracy theories about the Jewish Illuminati? They all look the same to me. Dispensationalists, Date Setters, Conspiracy Theorists all look the same to me. Now don't get me wrong. I know there are groups of people who conspire to do things in secret, I just don't have any reason to think any of them are actually in control. But I'm open to the evidence if you've got some.
    This is not the board to discuss this. You cannot convince me otherwise, and I will not try to convince you. But I do know they are there; I've already met about five of them, plus one friend in Wisconsin. Perhaps you'd like to talk to one who left the group. They are a tightly knit group. But it is not the Illuminati (as you call them) that is in control; it is the fake-money printers, and the Big Oil tycoons.

    You speak as if you have certainty about these theories. I think your confidence may not be as well founded as you think. In any case, if you want to make your case for the Jewish Illuminati, it would probably be best to start a new thread devoted to that topic.
    Agreed. But I have no desire to debate you on this. You are already grounded with the minority on this, and have no intentions on accepting it. With folks like Henry Kissinger, George Soros, Larry Mizel, Michael Chertoff, and so many more, they are all reportedly Ashkenazi Jews. I've read General Patton's diary on some of these Jews, and he had very few good things to say about Russian Jews of the Bolsheviks. No matter the designation, it is clear that banking, and oil are their primary means of control. That is why they continue to seek all of the worlds oil resources, and force all nations to submit to the Petro-Dollar system.

    If you do not agree, then let it be that. As one of my associates from Idaho once told me, "Do not waste your gold on those who refuse to listen. Do not try to recruit them. If they insult you without the facts, simply move on because you can't waste your time trying to awaken someone who has no desire to know". My focus here is eschatology, and not necessarily exposing conspiracies. Great people such as Debbie on YouTube (Sane Progressive) who is a Registered Nurse, highly educated, and was once a Bernie Sanders supporter, now knows how the system of government is nothing but one big show. And that is all it is; a show for the masses to keep us divided by choosing a side; Republican or Democrat, and I've tasted both, and both are worthless. I do not have faith in any of them. And I certainly do not have faith in a government that supports a people who are allowed to kill Palestinians based on a lie.
    Israel is more than just a race; it is more than just a nation; it is the people of God, from faith, by faith, and only faith. Those who assemble in the name of Christ Jesus, embrance Israel because they are Israel

  2. #242
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    Just to make sure this is not hidden by non-related discussion, here again is the Talmudic Rabbi's curse on those who open the book of Daniel. The problem is the Talmud comes in a vast collection of books. This source came from a minister in Australia who apparently used a book containing the entire section on Talmudic Laws. But gaining access to an official Talmud is not easy.

    A varient reading is as follows:

    Blasted be the bones of those who calculate the end. For they would say, since the predetermined time has arrived, and yet he has not come, he will never come.? - Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Sanhedrin 97b, London, Soncino Edition

    But there is no telling if this is the same selection since it is based on a collection of Talmudic readings. Plus this variant doesn't even mention the book of Daniel.

    UPDATE: I was just told by a friend of mine that it is believed that the "Curse" was created by a bad Rabbi during the dark ages, but no exact name and/or time was given. So the quote may not have appeared in any original copies of the Talmud (which are many I might add). The curse is believed to have been later written as a result of the Rabbi's strong hatred for Christians. I was also told that Rabbi's today oppose the "Rabbi's Curse" writing and believes this to have been made up by Christians in England.

    So to be fair, this is not an exact quote, and validating the quote is not easy since the Talmud is not readily available to us Goy (Gentiles).

    Joe
    Last edited by TheForgiven; 09-26-2017 at 06:53 PM.
    Israel is more than just a race; it is more than just a nation; it is the people of God, from faith, by faith, and only faith. Those who assemble in the name of Christ Jesus, embrance Israel because they are Israel

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough
    Hey there my friend!

    What do you imagine "being back with God" would entail? How would that work? We both know that belief in God is indistinguishable from a total delusion. So what exactly are you hoping to see? How would it change anything?
    Is it a "fact" that belief in God (or any god) is delusional? Wouldn't that be merely an opinion based on your own personal feelings? Faith is the belief in what we do not always see. And I for one do believe in God. My life is not a direct reflection of his righteousness, but I do believe. With so many Old Testament prophesies being proven, in such a long span of time, I'd say something has to be right. You certainly don't see the kinds of witnesses found throughout history in other religions compared to Christianity.
    Are you saying that you have a way to distinguish between belief in God and a delusion? Which God? Any God? Why is belief in the Mormon God who lives on the planet Kolab delusional but not the belief in Yahweh who likes the smell of burning goat fat and is obsessed with male genital mutilation? If you have a way to distinguish between beliefs with no evidence and delusions, please share.

    You say you believe because of fulfilled prophecies? Then you belief is in grave danger, since I have never seen anyone able to prove any prophecies have been fulfilled. Indeed, Christianity began as a failed doomsday cult - they all believed the end would come "soon" ... 2000 years ago! I think a discussion of "fulfilled prophecy" would be very interesting. Take a look at this thread and contribute to it if you feel so inclined: Does Fulfilled Prophecy Prove the Bible?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    But even if you should continue in disbelief or rejection, certainly doesn't warrant any ridicule from those who believe. Wouldn't you agree?
    I agree! I did not intend any "ridicule." I'm sorry if you felt offended. I was just speaking plainly about what I believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    I understand this position, and I know that I am no better than those who do not believe. But my heart tells me there is much more to life than obeying governments, paying bills, and mowing the lawn.
    And your Bible tells you that "the heart is deceitful above all things" so why would you trust what it says?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    I believe God has already done all that is necessary. I do not believe that God is up there waiting for people to pray to Him so he can answer their prayers. One of the sacrifices or costs associated with "free choice" is also "personal responsibility". I suppose I'd rather believe in a God that permits us to make mistakes, learn from them, and move on from there, as opposed to relying on a God or god to solve every problem for us. At the same time, I hope and pray for his protection.
    Your God is nothing like the God of the Bible. The Bible tells you to TRUST GOD and to PRAY and BELIEVE that he cares for you and will help you and is totally trustworthy. But we all know those things are not true. God cannot be trusted for ANYTHING in this life. Not. One. Thing. If God were half as trustworthy as the average dentist there would be no doubt about his existence. Parents who trust God for the health of their children end up with dead children and manslaughter convictions. The religion is demonstrably delusional. It is based on a fundamental falsehood that God is trustworthy when in truth there is not one thing that anyone can trust God to do in this life.

    Well, it's dinner time. I'll answer more as time permits.

    Great chatting! It's good to be back at it.

    Richard
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Amiel McGough View Post
    Are you saying that you have a way to distinguish between belief in God and a delusion? Which God? Any God? Why is belief in the Mormon God who lives on the planet Kolab delusional but not the belief in Yahweh who likes the smell of burning goat fat and is obsessed with male genital mutilation? If you have a way to distinguish between beliefs with no evidence and delusions, please share.

    You say you believe because of fulfilled prophecies? Then you belief is in grave danger, since I have never seen anyone able to prove any prophecies have been fulfilled. Indeed, Christianity began as a failed doomsday cult - they all believed the end would come "soon" ... 2000 years ago! I think a discussion of "fulfilled prophecy" would be very interesting. Take a look at this thread and contribute to it if you feel so inclined: Does Fulfilled Prophecy Prove the Bible?


    I agree! I did not intend any "ridicule." I'm sorry if you felt offended. I was just speaking plainly about what I believe.


    And your Bible tells you that "the heart is deceitful above all things" so why would you trust what it says?


    Your God is nothing like the God of the Bible. The Bible tells you to TRUST GOD and to PRAY and BELIEVE that he cares for you and will help you and is totally trustworthy. But we all know those things are not true. God cannot be trusted for ANYTHING in this life. Not. One. Thing. If God were half as trustworthy as the average dentist there would be no doubt about his existence. Parents who trust God for the health of their children end up with dead children and manslaughter convictions. The religion is demonstrably delusional. It is based on a fundamental falsehood that God is trustworthy when in truth there is not one thing that anyone can trust God to do in this life.

    Well, it's dinner time. I'll answer more as time permits.

    Great chatting! It's good to be back at it.

    Richard
    Could this be the highlight of the reasons why you oppose God? I certainly understand your dislike and what also appears to be a disgust towards those who believe in God. I suppose we could imagine it like this. You and I are coaching a football team. We train our players to perform to the best of their abilities. But if our team isn't doing so well, are we doing them any justice by playing the game for them? No, all we can do is continue to train them, and encourage them to keep trying. God rarely intervened when it came to health problems. Sure Christ did a few miracles to prove his Testimony of being the Messiah. But this was not the norm. God does not always intervene in life; in fact rarely does he ever do so. When people get sick, they die. Then again, could it also be that our lack of obedience, and continued life in sinning, may be the reasons why God does not answer prayer? I don't know. But this I do know. Buddy I have been through a lot in this life....a hell of a lot. I've been through a divorce that nearly crushed me emotionally (from a cheating spouse), my finances were torn apart leading to full bankruptcy. I've come down with a life threatening colon cancer wherein I was told I only had 5 years to live; that was in 2003, and yet here I am. I was nearly killed in a motorcycle accident, but I am still here. I had 13 simulated heart attacks caused by bad medication, and yet I am still here. I lost my daughter which almost killed me and my wife, and was the reason why I dropped out of Church in the first place, but I am still here. I don't have the answers for you. I can't wave the magic wand and prove that God exists. This is a decision that only you can make. No one has the right to force you. Then again, no one who disbelieves has the same right to ridicule eor chastise anyone who does believe.

    But I still love you as a friend.....can you despite my belief in God? If not, then perhaps that is your answer.

    Joe
    Israel is more than just a race; it is more than just a nation; it is the people of God, from faith, by faith, and only faith. Those who assemble in the name of Christ Jesus, embrance Israel because they are Israel

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    Could this be the highlight of the reasons why you oppose God?
    I wouldn't say I "oppose God" but rather that I oppose the belief in a God that does not exist.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    I certainly understand your dislike and what also appears to be a disgust towards those who believe in God.
    I'm sorry you got that impression. It's not my intent at all. I don't see believers as disgusting. On the contrary, they are just like everyone else. Religious belief is common to most people. I was a believer myself. I don't look back and think how bad I was because I was a believer. Of course, I do have a deep disgust for people who pervert truth to defend their false beliefs and deceive gullible believer (charlatans like Benny Hinn, etc.).

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    I suppose we could imagine it like this. You and I are coaching a football team. We train our players to perform to the best of their abilities. But if our team isn't doing so well, are we doing them any justice by playing the game for them? No, all we can do is continue to train them, and encourage them to keep trying. God rarely intervened when it came to health problems. Sure Christ did a few miracles to prove his Testimony of being the Messiah. But this was not the norm. God does not always intervene in life; in fact rarely does he ever do so. When people get sick, they die. Then again, could it also be that our lack of obedience, and continued life in sinning, may be the reasons why God does not answer prayer? I don't know. But this I do know. Buddy I have been through a lot in this life....a hell of a lot. I've been through a divorce that nearly crushed me emotionally (from a cheating spouse), my finances were torn apart leading to full bankruptcy. I've come down with a life threatening colon cancer wherein I was told I only had 5 years to live; that was in 2003, and yet here I am. I was nearly killed in a motorcycle accident, but I am still here. I had 13 simulated heart attacks caused by bad medication, and yet I am still here. I lost my daughter which almost killed me and my wife, and was the reason why I dropped out of Church in the first place, but I am still here. I don't have the answers for you. I can't wave the magic wand and prove that God exists. This is a decision that only you can make. No one has the right to force you. Then again, no one who disbelieves has the same right to ridicule eor chastise anyone who does believe.
    It sad to hear what you've been through, but I don't see how it helps your case. On the contrary, your words prove my point. God cannot actually be trusted to do anything for anyone in any situation. This directly contradicts the primary teaching of Scripture, which is repeated constantly from every pulpit, that "God is trustworthy." That assertion is demonstrably false and so to believe it is demonstrably delusional. That was my point, and you life seems to confirm it.

    The fact that you are "still here" means nothing, because atheists have gone through similar tribulations and they are still here, whereas many Christian children who begged God for just a piece of bread have died horrible deaths. There's no correlation between belief in God and what happens to you in this life, so we know there is no God helping believers in any measurable fashion, so to say that "God is trustworthy" is delusional. I wrote about this on my blog in an article called: Is God Trustworthy? The Root of Religious Delusion.

    And this brings us back to my original questions - What do you imagine "being back with God" would entail? How would that work? We both know that belief in God is indistinguishable from a total delusion. So what exactly are you hoping to see? How would it change anything?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    But I still love you as a friend.....can you despite my belief in God? If not, then perhaps that is your answer.

    Joe
    You're a good friend Joe. I have no problem with your belief in God. I've just been telling you why I don't share your belief.

    Great chatting,

    Richard
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by TheForgiven View Post
    Name:  Capture.JPG
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    Just to make sure this is not hidden by non-related discussion, here again is the Talmudic Rabbi's curse on those who open the book of Daniel. The problem is the Talmud comes in a vast collection of books. This source came from a minister in Australia who apparently used a book containing the entire section on Talmudic Laws. But gaining access to an official Talmud is not easy.

    A varient reading is as follows:

    Blasted be the bones of those who calculate the end. For they would say, since the predetermined time has arrived, and yet he has not come, he will never come.? - Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Sanhedrin 97b, London, Soncino Edition

    But there is no telling if this is the same selection since it is based on a collection of Talmudic readings. Plus this variant doesn't even mention the book of Daniel.

    UPDATE: I was just told by a friend of mine that it is believed that the "Curse" was created by a bad Rabbi during the dark ages, but no exact name and/or time was given. So the quote may not have appeared in any original copies of the Talmud (which are many I might add). The curse is believed to have been later written as a result of the Rabbi's strong hatred for Christians. I was also told that Rabbi's today oppose the "Rabbi's Curse" writing and believes this to have been made up by Christians in England.

    So to be fair, this is not an exact quote, and validating the quote is not easy since the Talmud is not readily available to us Goy (Gentiles).

    Joe
    Forget the fear of knowing, fear of studying, fear of doing the work of preparing.... forget fear of Jews, forget fear itself, and read Daniel, read the prophets, read Revelation, for as it states even if just reading with half a mind and half a heart, there is a blessing in just reading Revelation.

    Any human catches the drift and at least some of the message.

    Encouraging people not to read is diabolitical, just because you fear you might get it wrong.

    'Even if you just know 'This world is not my home, Im just a passing through'..Its better than 'nothing will ever happen mindlessness.

  7. #247
    Daniel was a Christian because he knew the Lord, he knew the Messiah to come..... and wrote exactly what the Lord told him, over and over and over again...in precise exact detail, and it all meshes together perfectly and is backed up extensively by other prophetic books exactly.

    And the ignorant Jews that knew not the Lord try to put fear and a curse in anyone studying Daniel etc.... because they hate those that know the Messiah...

  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidjayjordan View Post
    Daniel was a Christian because he knew the Lord, he knew the Messiah to come..... and wrote exactly what the Lord told him, over and over and over again...in precise exact detail, and it all meshes together perfectly and is backed up extensively by other prophetic books exactly.

    And the ignorant Jews that knew not the Lord try to put fear and a curse in anyone studying Daniel etc.... because they hate those that know the Messiah...
    Amen my friend. Of course we have to be reminded that the "ignorant Jews" were only this way because their hearts and minds were dulled by the Will of God; He gave them a spirit of stupor in order to keep them from seeing the truth. The time of stupor came to an end as Isaiah foretold. For when Isaiah cried out, "How Long O'Lord?" To which the Lord replied, "Until cities are destroyed and the land (Israel) is laid wasted". This of course was fulfilled in the first century when the entire land of Israel was nearly wiped out by the Romans.

    The Rabbi's curse doesn't frighten me because I know we have a higher power; Jesus the Messiah, and the Rabbi's will never win over Christ. The Talmudic Babylonians (which is what they truly are) are teaching a satanic doctrine, especially when teaching their young that Jesus is currently boiling in his own excrement (feces). So sad! What's even worse is fake Jews such as Sarah Silverman jokes about the crucifixion of Christ, wherein she said on stage, "I hope the Jews did kill Christ, because I'd "f-ing" do it again!" So sad.

    Joe
    Israel is more than just a race; it is more than just a nation; it is the people of God, from faith, by faith, and only faith. Those who assemble in the name of Christ Jesus, embrance Israel because they are Israel

  9. #249
    Close Joe, but your timeline definitely needs work.

    Remember Joe, earthquakes, volcanos exploding, hirricanes, eclipses etc... are just a fore warning of bigger events coming. The next event is not the Great White Throne Judgment..... thats naive.

    The Mid East must erupt, more earthquakes, exploding volcanos on the ring of Fire...... and THEN the Mid East Peace Covenant... to cool the most aggressive country in the world (before an even more aggressive and anti-god country takes over.

    Do take note of the present troubles for Putin, as he will eventually be replaced, as he is not the AC.

    Do know that a race or a religion does not determine ones heart or choices.... or final destination. Thats racism... and the Lord is not a racist. People join groups for supposed advanatage sake, but only individuals with courage and guts make it into His Kingdom..... by choice, not by birth or gender or intelligence, or passports, or trickery.

    He can be the prince of the Covenant, but can NOT be the AC...

    Come on Joe, get your location together, your finances, together, your doctrine together so you can help and prepare so many others.

    Got to fly.

    LIJ

    David

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