Catholic Answers Censored the Bible Wheel!


Update 9/28/10: For general accuracy and respect towards Catholics, I have edited this post to remove some of the unnecessarily inflammatory comments that I wrote in the heat of the moment. I was utterly shocked and dismayed to have the conversation cut short just when I felt progress was being made, and I think I over-reacted and even conflated some of these events with some past abuse I have received on other (Protestant) forums. After posting and reviewing the entire thread, I see that my comments were not completely accurate. I apologize to any and all who may have been offended, and I will seek to do better from now on.


On Sept 14, 2010 a user v1gilbert began a thread on the Catholic Answers forum with these words:

I was challenged by a person to look, with an open mind, at the claims of The Bible Wheel; those claims basically add up to the following: The Protestant Canon of Scripture was divinely inspired, thus excluding Catholic and Orthodox. It was all very mathematical, complex and convoluted so I don’t want to take my time in trying to understand it to refute it; I was hoping someone here had already come across a good debunking article or website.

Here is the website:

The post continued with an explanation of the Bible Wheel that I had written on some forum long ago.

The thread quickly took off. In less than two weeks it had nearly 3000 views. I was assaulted with all the typical and predictable ignorant, moronic, and indeed, godless comments that most “Christians” seem to have built in as part of their genetic code. They asked if I had taken my meds. They made jokes about dartboards and steering wheels. They likened me to Joseph Smith and called the Bible Wheel “anti-Christian.” One person implied I was schizophrenic and another said I was either a heretic or an unbeliever.

As many of these empty, ignorant, and abusive posts began to accumulate, one member, InspiritCarol, declared that the Bible Wheel had been completely refuted and so there was no need to present any more evidence since it would just fall on “deaf ears.” Here is the interaction I had with her in Post #137 in which she had presented a ludicrous list of moronic posts as if they actually contained some refutation of the Bible Wheel:

Originally Posted by InspritCarol

I invite you to please revisit post #’s: 2, 3, 7, 11, 13, 14, 17, 19, 21, especially 29, 30, especially 40, 44, especially 48, 61, 73 an on and on; I feel that I could sit here all night typing examples of what is wrong with the “Bible Wheel” but it would fall on deaf ears. For a powerful example of pattern application check out the Ron Howard film “A Beautiful Mind”.

Originally Posted by RichardMcGough

Your comment contains three fundamental errors.

  1. Most of the posts you cite do not even contain an attempt to refute the BW, let alone a valid refutation. Indeed, most of the posts you cite have little if anything to do with anything I have ever written! For example, the first post you cite (#2) begins with a string of unsupported assertions like it’s “hogwash” and “a game that anyone can play.” There is nothing in that post that actually engages any statement that I have ever made. It is therefore absurd in the extreme for you to include it in your list. Likewise, post #3 begins with the completely irrelevant comment that “The Bible is not a code to deciphered.” Again, this has nothing to do with anything I have ever asserted about the BW. And the pattern continues. The next post your cite (#7) makes no direct statement about anything I have written. And the next post you cite (#11) makes the false assertion that I appealed to the Sepher Yetzirah as an authoritative basis for the BW. Victor corrected this error when he explained the obvious, namely, that the Sepher Yetzirah gave me an heuristic motivation to put the books in a circle. I have NEVER claimed it has any authority. I could go on like this through nearly every post your cited. Your list is absurd in the extreme. How in the world did you think you could fool people? Did you think that no one would actually read the posts you cited???
  2. I am not deaf. On the contrary, I have been gifted with a most acute sense of “hearing” false arguments against the BW and I am always eager to answer any attempt at any refutation.
  3. I read “A Beautiful Mind” and I saw the movie. Your implicit association of my work with the schizophrenic ravings of John Nash is outside the bounds of rational discourse. You owe me an apology.

You now have a choice. You can produce one serious refutation of something I have written, or you can admit that your feeling that you “could sit here all night typing examples of what is wrong with the Bible Wheel” is not based on fact. Personally, I hope you choose the former. It should be interesting. And besides, given your level of confidence, it should only take you a few minutes, right?

May God bless you richly,


To Carol’s credit, she apologized for implying I was “schizophrenic.” One other user, teak421, also apologized for speaking out of ignorance. I was beginning to get hopeful that a genuine fruitful discussion of my work might finally be possible.

As the thread continued, I answered every question with ease and with each answer the evidence for the validity of the Bible Wheel began to blaze like the noontime sun in a cloudless sky. So Catholic Answers had no choice. They could not merely ban me and leave the thread, since that would leave all the evidence in place. So they followed the path of all tyrants  – they censored the evidence! Catholic Answers DELETED THE ENTIRE THREAD!

The thread was pretty young. It only had 12 pages but already outranked most other threads for views. Thankfully, I was able to save the last four pages (which were the pages I had participated in) because they were in the cache on my own machine, and I was able to save most of the other pages because they were already cached on Google (link). So I have all the evidence of the suppression of truth by Catholic Answers.

I consider this a PUBLIC DECLARATION by Catholic Answers that they are absolutely incapable of refuting the Bible Wheel.

I invite all Catholics (and any other interested parties) to this blog (or my forum where this is also being discussed) to correct anything they think might be a misrepresentation of this situation. And don’t worry, I won’t CENSOR THE EVIDENCE to protect my position.

I have posted the entire thread that Catholic Answers foolishly thought the could hide. The first 100 posts can be read here, and the final 76 posts here.

Posted in Bible Wheel Tagged with: ,
16 comments on “Catholic Answers Censored the Bible Wheel!
  1. Here is an email I sent to the super-moderators on Catholic Forum after Michael Francis unjustly deleted the Bible Wheel thread.

    From: Richard Amiel McGough []
    Sent: Monday, September 27, 2010 1:30 PM
    To: ‘’
    Subject: Deletion of the thread called “The Bible Wheel proves the Protestant Canon is correct!”

    RE: Deletion of the thread called “The Bible Wheel proves the Protestant Canon is correct!”


    Moderator Michael Francis stated the thread was deleted for the following reasons:

    “The Bible wheel thread was pulled because it had exhausted its topic and promoted another errant man-made theory in contradiction to historical facts. As such, promoting it conflicts with the purpose of Catholic Answers Forums and is not allowed.”

    I challenged his assertion by stating that I had reviewed the rules and found no violations. He responded by asserting I had broken two rules:

    Enforcement #3. Judgments by the Moderators can be discussed with the Moderators via private messaging but not on the board itself. Decisions of the Moderators may be appealed to the Super Moderators.

    Banned Topics #26. Promoting unapproved apparitions and revelations (those not approved by the Church for private or public devotion) or alleged private locutions

    The first charge is absurd in the extreme because it is in reference to a second thread concerning the deletion of the first thread in which I asked “What are they afraid of?”. That “violation” did not exist at the time the first thread was deleted. So Michael Francis is not merely wrong on this point – he is absurdly wrong! The thread was not deleted because of that infraction.

    And the second reason is even more absurd. I have never at any time claimed that the Bible Wheel was the result of a personal “apparition” or “revelation.” On the contrary, I clearly and repeatedly explained how I had discovered it as a NATURAL consequence of my study Scripture that anyone could reproduce and check for themselves. I explicitly stated that I claimed no authority of any kind, and that all I wanted was to have my assertions tested by logic and facts. Simple as that. MICHAEL FRANCIS IS A LIAR. His accusations are FALSE.

    The thread was not deleted while everyone was having loads of fun mocking me like demons from the very pit of hell. The thread was deleted for one reason and one reason only. The evidence for the validity of the Bible Wheel is overwhelming and incontrovertible, and folks at Catholic Answers are desperately terrified because this threatens their weak and infantile understanding of the Catholic Magisterium.

    I’m not expecting any justice from godless freaks like you. I’m just informing you of the UTTER CORRUPTION of your forum and the fact that I will be using your censorship as evidence the overwhelming power and validity of the Bible Wheel. Also, I saved all the wicked abuse your members spewed on me WITH NO CORRECTION FROM THE MODERATORS so I have plenty of evidence to support my case.


  2. Blackie says:

    Your remarks are exemplary of your “Christian” charity. Is this the fruit of your devotion to God as a result of your “discovery”?

  3. What would you know about Christian charity?

    Your comment is as sinuous as the serpent in the Garden.

    You godless self-inflated freaks never cease to amaze me. You have ZERO self-awareness! Your comments are as predictable as they are deluded and self-refuting. You use the idea of “Christian charity” to bash and attack! You are so ridiculously stupid that you don’t even know what you are doing.

    I would be delighted if you would like to actually engage me in a discussion of the FACTS relating to the wicked abuse spewed out on the Catholic Answers forum and their censorship of the truth, but I am pretty confident that you would never think to do such a thing, because you know that you have no facts on your side. You are nothing but another ignorant internet sniper. Good riddance to you and your fake religious liars.

  4. Andy says:

    Are you going to post the entire discussion? I am interested in reading the arguments. Thanks God Bless

  5. Yes – that is my intent. Should have it available by tomorrow. But as for “arguments” – there’s not much to post, unless you think “It’s all hogwash” and “You are schizophrenic” form legitimate “arguments.”

  6. Blackie says:

    Lessee here. I’ll let the Bible you claim to be so into comment on your response to me.

    Matthew 12:34
    [34] You brood of vipers! how can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

    Luke 6:45
    [45] The good man out of the good treasure of his heart produces good, and the evil man out of his evil treasure produces evil; for out of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaks.

    1st Corinthian 13:[2] And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.

    James Chapter 3
    [1] Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, for you know that we who teach shall be judged with greater strictness.
    [2] For we all make many mistakes, and if any one makes no mistakes in what he says he is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.
    [3] If we put bits into the mouths of horses that they may obey us, we guide their whole bodies.
    [4] Look at the ships also; though they are so great and are driven by strong winds, they are guided by a very small rudder wherever the will of the pilot directs.
    [5] So the tongue is a little member and boasts of great things. How great a forest is set ablaze by a small fire!
    [6] And the tongue is a fire. The tongue is an unrighteous world among our members, staining the whole body, setting on fire the cycle of nature, and set on fire by hell.
    [7] For every kind of beast and bird, of reptile and sea creature, can be tamed and has been tamed by humankind,
    [8] but no human being can tame the tongue — a restless evil, full of deadly poison.
    [9] With it we bless the Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who are made in the likeness of God.
    [10] From the same mouth come blessing and cursing. My brethren, this ought not to be so.
    [11] Does a spring pour forth from the same opening fresh water and brackish?
    [12] Can a fig tree, my brethren, yield olives, or a grapevine figs? No more can salt water yield fresh.
    [13] Who is wise and understanding among you? By his good life let him show his works in the meekness of wisdom.

  7. All the verses you cited obviously apply to you.

    You are a godless freak with no self-awareness whatsoever. The evidence is obvious from your first post in which you accused me of lacking “Christian charity” even as you perversely attacked me in unrighteousness! I proved that Michael Francis lied and that Catholic Answers unjustly suppressed and deleted the TRUTH and you ignore the facts and choose rather to attack me for declaring the truth.

    You are one “special” piece of work.

    But let me repeat my invitation. I would be absolutely delighted if you would DARE to address any facts of this issue. But you won’t do that, will you? No, of course not, because you know with perfect certainty that you have no facts on your side. Yet you will continue to believe that you are justified in your attack on me? Folks like you are just plain insane.

    I’ve been dealing with pseudo-Christian freaks like you for nearly a decade. I know all your tricks, how you appeal to Scripture even as you violate the very Scriptures you are citing! You people blow my mind! I never could imagine that anyone could behave the way you fake Christians behave. You are amongst the most ludicrous hypocrites on the planet.

  8. I have posted the entire thread that Catholic Answers foolishly thought they could hide. The first 100 posts can be read here, and the final 76 posts here.

  9. Mike Gridley says:

    Yeah, I was permabanned at CAF by Michael Francis, I consider it a badge of honor. You should count yourself blessed.

  10. Point well taken.

    It would be interesting to hear your story. What was your “crime” in the eyes of Michael Francis? Did you speak truth once too often?

  11. With the name of Allah, Peace be unto those who follow the guidance from their Lord.

    I haven’t heard from you in a long time. I hope all is well with your health and faith. Yeah I know what it is like to be censored and to be banned. I had to enable comment moderation on my blog because it was the responsible thing to do.

    People posting links to porn sites, speaking rubbish including filthy language, etc or people using your site for free advertising. It’s a shame when people do not wish to communicate with one another.


    Catholic Answers Forum ? or is it something else. yesterday I was banned for ever,, the reason given “anti Semitic agenda. I have always tried not to be drawn into this kind of argument. I started a thread about landlords and moneylenders, writing about landlords and moneylenders was said to be anti semitic. most of the C A F MEMBERS who replied were Jewish. I have no way of asking for proof , to prove I had a agenda,
    Is There any way I can see my postings so I can copy them, so who runs the Catholic forum, no one is allowed to discuss evolution. is not evolution “Gods Potters Wheel”

  13. Yes, it was the Catholic Answers forum:

    You should be able to clear the cookies from our computer, or use a different computer, and view and save the comments you wrote.

  14. Hi Jonathan,

    My health is well, my faith is being reevaluated. Thanks for the concern. I hope all is well with you.

    And yes, it is a pain that I have to moderate all the comments in my blog. But there are just too many spammers.

  15. Samuel Vale says:

    How amazing is his grace and loving kindness towards us. From our youth, every inclination of our hearts, drawn to evil. We are so fragile, our spirits so easily wounded and entangled, unless we hand it all over to him. The bible wheel, wow, a fantastic discovery. There is no need for you to defend it with with your naked heart. Those who have the spirit will discern what is of the spirit, the rest cannot understand it, it is foolishness to them. Your untamed prophetic gift is like a wild horse, your words like hooves smashing the teeth of those who would try to take away what he has given you. Will you give the Bible Wheel back to Jesus? Will you let him defend it and preserve it?

  16. Samuel,

    Your words are as true as they are beautiful. You have a great gift of poetry.

    The hooves of a horse are needful, but I would not want my soul encrusted by such hard and sharp material. And yes, I would like to give all back to the ALL from whom I received it. Thanks for the reminder.


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