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Thread: Spoke 12

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    Very interesting! Which manuscript did you find these number/letters in? Some mss spell them out in words, others use gematria.
    The Greek Textus Receptus
    http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible...1&t=KJV#conc/5

    Whereas the GNT Morph spells out the numbers.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post
    The Greek Textus Receptus
    http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible...1&t=KJV#conc/5

    Whereas the GNT Morph spells out the numbers.
    Oh yeah, of course. I've got those two versions in my database: TR Rev 7:5 (gematria used) vs. NA27 Rev 7:5 (number words used)

    So which do you think was the "original?"
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    Oh yeah, of course. I've got those two versions in my database: TR Rev 7:5 (gematria used) vs. NA27 Rev 7:5 (number words used)

    So which do you think was the "original?"
    That's a good question. I haven't made any opinion on it. I always thought that the TR is the original or the copy of the original.

  4. #24
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    Spoke 12

    Happy Christmas everyone!


    Hi gilgal,

    The importance is this. If they fail to prove themselves to be Jewish, then the land doesn't belong to them.
    All that information about who might naturally of Israel, goes completely against the spirit of the law which we see in Deuteronomy. Even before Sinai, God states that as long as a slave, or a 'stranger' in their household, has been circumcised, they are free to partake of the Passover meal.

    There are several places in the Bible where God states that all the earth is His. He specifically says that the land which Israel now seeks to possess is never to be sold. It cannot be bought. Then, there is the matter of the jubilees, when everyone who had been in financial trouble and having to work of his debt, should have been free to return to his portion of the land which he had inherited it.

    The matter of inheritance - and how God gives Himself as an inheritance to the Levites - speaks strongly of the role of the firstborn becoming priest in his own household. Levi was chosen by God as an offering to Himself instead of the firstborn in every family. As Jesus was the firstborn Son of God, in whom we receive a double portion of the Holy Spirit (as co-heirs with Him) I see 'the land' fading into insignificance in the New Covenant. There is nowhere in the New Testament that 'the land' (referring to that portion given to Abraham) which any one of the writers mentions. As they began to receive their inheritance in God while the Romans were in occupation, they easily took on the label of 'strangers and pilgrims' in this world. See Hebrews 11 and 1 Peter 2.

    Furthermore, at Sinai, in Exodus 19:5, God is bargaining with them, and promises to make them a kingdom of priests 'IF' the obey His voice. Then He said 'for all the earth is mine'. This is in keeping with Paul's interpretation of what God had said to Abraham - not only that the gospel had been preached to him, but Romans 4:13, that he should be 'heir of the world'. This leads to a picture of the whole world being 'Israel' - that over which God has prevailed (Adam having failed in his commission as a steward, and having had to be baled out by God) - which would make plenty of room for everyone who has a right to dwell in His presence.

    What we see today is an unholy scramble by unbelievers, to take by force a 'possession' which according to the Biblical record, began to slip away from them in Solomon's day. God didn't promise the land to idolaters.

    In fact, Paul says this about 'the blessing of Abraham' Galatians 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. Note Paul's use of the word 'we'. Evidently he is including Gentile believers in Israel (as he does in Ephesians 2). Christ's work on the cross removed the outward separation between people groups, so that God's word to Abraham 'in thee shall all the nations of the earth be blessed' really did begin to come true - to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile - now having access to the Father by one Spirit.

    God has never cast Israel off. They have always been provided for, even when they were scattered throughout the nations, it was to bring God's name to the Gentiles (there's a verse for that somewhere) and, Micah 5:7 And the remnant of Jacob shall be in the midst of many people as a dew from the LORD, as the showers upon the grass, that tarrieth not for man, nor waiteth for the sons of men.
    Last edited by Charisma; 12-25-2011 at 04:52 AM.
    16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; 17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; 19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

    Ephesians 3

  5. #25
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    Nahum is somehow related to Exodus 34. Mountains are both mentioned but can't narrow down to any phrase or group of words in common.

    Keep feast(s)

    Exodus 12:14 And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever.
    Exodus 34:18 The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep. Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread, as I commanded thee, in the time of the month Abib: for in the month Abib thou camest out from Egypt.
    Nahum 1:15 Behold upon the mountains the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace! O Judah, keep thy solemn feasts, perform thy vows: for the wicked shall no more pass through thee; he is utterly cut off.

    earth swallowing the water:
    2 Kings 3:20 KJV - And it came to pass in the morning, when the meat offering was offered, that, behold, there came water by the way of Edom, and the country was filled with water.
    Revelation 12:16 KJV - And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

    Some say that the endtime Christians or Israelites will flee to Edom for protection.

    Back to Nahum and Exodus 34:
    Exodus 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name [is] Jealous, [is] a jealous God:
    Nahum 1:2 God [is] jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and [is] furious; the LORD will take vengeance on his adversaries, and he reserveth [wrath] for his enemies.

    Exodus 34:7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear [the guilty]; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth [generation].
    Nahum 1:3 The LORD [is] slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit [the wicked]: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds [are] the dust of his feet.

    Also look at Exodus 34 and 2 Kings:
    Exodus 34:7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear [the guilty]; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth [generation].
    2 Kings 10:30 And the LORD said unto Jehu, Because thou hast done well in executing [that which is] right in mine eyes, [and] hast done unto the house of Ahab according to all that [was] in mine heart, thy children of the fourth [generation] shall sit on the throne of Israel.
    2 Kings 15:12 This [was] the word of the LORD which he spake unto Jehu, saying, Thy sons shall sit on the throne of Israel unto the fourth [generation]. And so it came to pass.


    Both 2Kings and Nahum talk about the city filled with blood:
    2Kings is Jerusalem in Manasseh's time which is when God promised a captivity even when Manasseh repented and was forgiven.
    Nahum is Nineveh as God through Nahum promised it would come.
    Last edited by gilgal; 12-28-2011 at 09:13 AM.

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