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Thread: God Allows Rape

  1. #41
    Good morning to you RAM and Rose.

    The weird thing about the Canaanites is Noah said they would be a servant of Ham's brothers. How could this be possible when God instructed to rid the land of the Canaanites by slaughter in the land of Israel?

    I think the Canaanites would have to remain somewhat alive to back Noah's drunken outburst... Genesis 9:20-27 http://quod.lib.umich.edu/k/kjv/browse.html

  2. #42
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    [QUOTE=RAM;43561]Hey there CWH,

    You are reading an English translation. The word "wife" is not actually mentioned in the Hebrew. It literally says "his woman." And he is called her "baal" which means lord or ruler. This exemplifies again the explicit sexism of the Bible. Men are called the "lord" over their women. And this was not just in the OT. Peter said that Christian women should emulate Sarah and call their husbands lord:
    1 Peter 3:5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands: 6 Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.


    Whether wife or woman it doesn't matter ,it means the same thing. So was Eve called Woman and yet we all know she was the wife of Adam.

    See that? Christian women are supposed to be in subjection to their husbands, obeying them, and calling them "lord." This sexism is fundamental to Christianity. Indeed, it is as fundamental as the very relationship between God, Christ, and man:
    1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
    Men are over women in the same way as Christ is over men!
    So is the government over its citizens and the law over above any one in the country, boss over his employees. In human society there is always hierarchy of rank in order for it to function effectively; it's a matte of fact.

    Captured women were put in subjection to those who murdered their moms, dads, family, and friends.
    Captured people whether women or men are always put into subjection by their victors.

    If that's how God does things, why did he fail to mention it anywhere in the Bible? And if it's not in the Bible, why do you feel free to make it up and suggest it is what God will do?
    It's the nature of God to hide things and for men to find out, which is why Jesu talks allegorically and used parables.

    You don't know how many of the 32,000 virgins committed suicide or were killed trying to escape. But one thing is clear - they were women captured in war and put in subjugation to the soldiers that murdered everyone they ever loved. Religion has corrupted your sense of morals if you cannot see how wrong this is.
    How about those who justified the killing of Osama, Saddam, Pol Pot, Hitler are their senses also been corrupted?

    There is no end to the irony of Christians justifying genocide even as they claim that we would have no morals if not for the God of the Bible.
    I justify the killing of evil men but not good men. I believe you agree with me.

    The word "humbled" in this context means "screwed" as in "having had sexual intercourse with." It's easy to prove. I'll leave that as an exercise for the student since I have little time this morning.
    Check any English dictionary, "humbled" has never mean "screwed". So one have humbled his wife and the wife have humbled her husband after sex sex....Brilliant! "Hey, Darling, can you humble me tonight?".

    And when you seem ignorant of the oppressive nature of patriarchy. The captive women were on the bottom of the social scale. First, they were war booty. Then they had thief virginity taken away, so if they were let go they would be seen as "used goods" in a society that prized virginity. You have no idea how difficult it would have been. Where is your empathy?
    They let them go so that they would not become widowed. Whether some compensation were given or not is not recorded. Anyway, those women have become part of God's family whose sin were pardoned. In fact, the words say if they have no more delight in her, they may let them go for free but they could still keep her if they wanted to.

    Yes, it sounds like a totally evil and wicked God because he constantly chooses VIOLENCE as if it were the best solution. He commands genocide and rape of the captive virgins. This makes him indistinguishable from a brutal Bronze age tribal war god. Why would God choose to act like that? Is he not free to show us a better way?
    I have asked, what would you do if you were God? Save everybody and polluted the world with people and pollution, Stop the wombs of evil women but allow the sperms of their evil men to spread....Brilliant!

    God Blessed us.
    Ask and You shall receive,
    Seek and You shall find,
    Knock and the door will be open unto You.

  3. #43
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    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    This displays the utter absurdity of the apologetic attempt to justify murder. They speak of the "horror of the Canaanite's sinfulness" when the Canaanites killed a few of their own children but see nothing wrong with God commanding the Israelites to murder ALL of their children!
    How did you know that the Canaanites killed a few of their own children? How about the chlldren of their captured booty?

    If God wanted to punish the Canaanites, why didn't he do it himself? To order his people to slice and dice women and children BRUTALIZES them and turns them in to the kind of monsters we saw in the videos. Why would God want to brutalize his own people that way? It makes no sense at all.
    Neither does it make sense for the US government to sent young soldiers to Afghanistan, Vietnam, Korea, Iraq to be killed or injured? Why can't the US government did it themselves by sending nuclear missiles or drones at those countries and save thousands of young lives and limbs? Answer this question and you will understand why God did not do it Himself. I am surprise you don't understand all these political and military strategies.

    When attempting to justify genocide, it is always smart to dehumanize those you want to murder. Otherwise, people will sense the moral outrage. This is what Hitler did - he dehumanized the Jews. How is the Christian justification of the genocide of the Canaanites any different?
    You are getting to the point, congrats, but is there a difference in killing evil men compared to killing righteous men? Do you want evil men killed or good men killed?

    May God Blessed the ignorant.
    Ask and You shall receive,
    Seek and You shall find,
    Knock and the door will be open unto You.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    See that? Christian women are supposed to be in subjection to their husbands, obeying them, and calling them "lord." This sexism is fundamental to Christianity. Indeed, it is as fundamental as the very relationship between God, Christ, and man:
    1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
    Men are over women in the same way as Christ is over men!
    So is the government over its citizens and the law over above any one in the country, boss over his employees. In human society there is always hierarchy of rank in order for it to function effectively; it's a matte of fact.
    So you are fine with the idea that men should rule over women, and women must be in subjection to men, obey them, and call them lord? I pity your wife.

    And as for governments - it is not the same at all. Men and women are equal under the law in the USA, and that's how it should be in all governments. You are showing (again) how religion retards moral and social progress!

    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    Captured people whether women or men are always put into subjection by their victors.
    Yes, and so the women were like slaves not "wives" as you like to imagine.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    If that's how God does things, why did he fail to mention it anywhere in the Bible? And if it's not in the Bible, why do you feel free to make it up and suggest it is what God will do?
    It's the nature of God to hide things and for men to find out, which is why Jesu talks allegorically and used parables.
    Finding something that is there is not the same as inventing something from your imagination.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    You don't know how many of the 32,000 virgins committed suicide or were killed trying to escape. But one thing is clear - they were women captured in war and put in subjugation to the soldiers that murdered everyone they ever loved. Religion has corrupted your sense of morals if you cannot see how wrong this is.
    How about those who justified the killing of Osama, Saddam, Pol Pot, Hitler are their senses also been corrupted?
    You are hiding from what I said by changing the subject.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    There is no end to the irony of Christians justifying genocide even as they claim that we would have no morals if not for the God of the Bible.
    I justify the killing of evil men but not good men. I believe you agree with me.
    I was not talking about killing evil men. Again, you are hiding from what I said by changed the subject.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    The word "humbled" in this context means "screwed" as in "having had sexual intercourse with." It's easy to prove. I'll leave that as an exercise for the student since I have little time this morning.
    Check any English dictionary, "humbled" has never mean "screwed". So one have humbled his wife and the wife have humbled her husband after sex sex....Brilliant! "Hey, Darling, can you humble me tonight?".
    You really need to learn the basic principles of Bible study. The Bible was not written in English. The Hebrew word translated as "humbled" is עִנָּה (Strong's 6031). Duane L. Christensen explained it's meaning in his entry on Deuteronomy 21:14 in the Word Biblical Commentary:
    The piel verbal form עִנָּה, which is translated here as 'you have humbled her,' carries the sense of 'doing violence to' in sexual matters (cf. 22:24, 29).
    The verses he cited make the truth of his claim perfectly obvious (note that they come from the same general context in Deuteronomy):
    Deuteronomy 22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her [have sex with her]; 24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.

    Deuteronomy 22:28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her [have sex with her], and they be found; 29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
    My interpretation stands. The word "humbled" means "screwed" or "had sexual intercourse with" in these contexts. It is totally obvious to anyone who can read even the English translation and it is supported by the scholars.

    Your mimicry of my use of "brilliant" is making you look really stupid since you don't know what you are talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    Yes, it sounds like a totally evil and wicked God because he constantly chooses VIOLENCE as if it were the best solution. He commands genocide and rape of the captive virgins. This makes him indistinguishable from a brutal Bronze age tribal war god. Why would God choose to act like that? Is he not free to show us a better way?
    I have asked, what would you do if you were God? Save everybody and polluted the world with people and pollution, Stop the wombs of evil women but allow the sperms of their evil men to spread....Brilliant!
    Again, your use of "brilliant" is idiotic. And you didn't answer my question. Why would God choose to act like a brutal Bronze age tribal war god? There are ten thousand things an Almighty God could have done rather than commanding more violence or letting the "sperms of their evil men to spread." For example, he could have just closed the wombs of the women that would have been impregnated by that sperm. Or he could have given some intelligent laws instead of the stupid, cruel, and immoral ones that we see in the Bible. But you can't see that because you are committed to the truth of things that are false. Good luck with that, Cheow.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  5. #45
    Hello CWH.

    You said evil men deserve to be destroyed. Does that apply to everyone?

    Do the Killing Laws that Moses gave still stand to this day to be enforced unto to this day? And if it's true that the Laws Moses gave do stand to this day,are people to be stoned to death and or the Gentiles have war made against them so their Mother's and Father's are slaughtered and the remaining virgins made into sex slaves? And are the Jewish people ''KILLED'' who refuse to comply with Mosaic Law as commanded by the Living Sovereign Almighty God who is the RIDER OF THE CLOUDS,ROCK OF AGES,THE ONE WHO WAS AND WHO IS AND WHO IS TO COME FOREVER AND EVER MORE ?
    Last edited by highflyertoo; 04-29-2012 at 06:44 PM.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by highflyertoo View Post
    Hello CWH.

    You said evil men deserve to be destroyed. Does that apply to everyone?

    Do the Killing Laws that Moses gave still stand to this day to be enforced unto to this day? And if it's true that the Laws Moses gave do stand to this day,are people to be stoned to death and or the Gentiles have war made against them so their Mother's and Father's are slaughtered and the remaining virgins made into sex slaves? And are the Jewish people ''KILLED'' who refuse to comply with Mosaic Law as commanded by the Living Sovereign Almighty God who is the RIDER OF THE CLOUDS,ROCK OF AGES,THE ONE WHO WAS AND WHO IS AND WHO IS TO COME FOREVER AND EVER MORE ?
    That is why we should "insure" ourselves by doing what is right, Love God with all your hear soul and might and Love your neighbor as yourself. God hate evil but love righteousness; that is what the Bible is all about... the eventual victory of good over evil. Just like life insurance, can you be very sure that you won't die, days, months, years from now? Can you be very sure that you will not see God when you die? People who have Near Death Experience will tell you that there is life after death and there are stories of Re-incarnation. Their stories are difficult to disprove scientifically.


    God Blessings to all.
    Ask and You shall receive,
    Seek and You shall find,
    Knock and the door will be open unto You.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    That is why we should "insure" ourselves by doing what is right, Love God with all your hear soul and might and Love your neighbor as yourself. God hate evil but love righteousness; that is what the Bible is all about... the eventual victory of good over evil. Just like life insurance, can you be very sure that you won't die, days, months, years from now? Can you be very sure that you will not see God when you die? People who have Near Death Experience will tell you that there is life after death and there are stories of Re-incarnation. Their stories are difficult to disprove scientifically.


    God Blessings to all.
    How can a false belief give any "insurance" about anything?

    In another thread, you said "It doesn't matter if God is Allah or what as long as you love God with all your heart, soul and strength and love your neighbor as yourself, you will be saved." Are you saying that all sincere Muslims, Mormons, Hindus, and anyone else who believes in any god is thereby saved? It seems like you are saying that Christianity doesn't matter at all. And if Christianity doesn't matter, why do you quote the Bible? Your comments make no sense to me at all. What do you do with this passage?
    Acts 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. 11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
    Is there or is there not another name by which men can be saved?

    You really don't sound like a Bible believing Christian to me. I guess there's hope for you after all!
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

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  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by CWH View Post
    That is why we should "insure" ourselves by doing what is right, Love God with all your hear soul and might and Love your neighbor as yourself. God hate evil but love righteousness; that is what the Bible is all about... the eventual victory of good over evil. Just like life insurance, can you be very sure that you won't die, days, months, years from now? Can you be very sure that you will not see God when you die? People who have Near Death Experience will tell you that there is life after death and there are stories of Re-incarnation. Their stories are difficult to disprove scientifically.


    God Blessings to all.
    And what do you mean by doing right?And what God are you specifically refering to,to do the right by?

    How can the Canaanites be held accountable when they thought they were serving their gods in a righteous manner?

    You said it may be that the God existing could be Allah, what if it's the Canaanites gods that exist when you go to the spirit world? Are you going to ask them for forgiveness because you don't want your soul snuffed out as you so enthuastically praised the soldiers for slaughtering the pagans,who by the way had never been given the oportunity to know and learn there was a God of the Hebrews.

    So how can you truly know you are doing right?Does your conscious lie to you or tell you the truth? Are you exempt from being deceived?

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by highflyertoo View Post
    You said it may be that the God existing could be Allah, what if it's the Canaanites gods that exist when you go to the spirit world? Are you going to ask them for forgiveness because you don't want your soul snuffed out as you so enthuastically praised the soldiers for slaughtering the pagans,who by the way had never been given the oportunity to know and learn there was a God of the Hebrews.
    Excellent points!
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    How can a false belief give any "insurance" about anything?

    In another thread, you said "It doesn't matter if God is Allah or what as long as you love God with all your heart, soul and strength and love your neighbor as yourself, you will be saved." Are you saying that all sincere Muslims, Mormons, Hindus, and anyone else who believes in any god is thereby saved? It seems like you are saying that Christianity doesn't matter at all. And if Christianity doesn't matter, why do you quote the Bible? Your comments make no sense to me at all. What do you do with this passage?
    Acts 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. 11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
    Is there or is there not another name by which men can be saved?

    You really don't sound like a Bible believing Christian to me. I guess there's hope for you after all!
    Listen carefully, I said that whatever god people refers to is indirectly referring to our God because there can only be one Creator God. Why do you think there are common beliefs among every religion that there is a heaven and there is a hell and to do good? Their god's name may be different but they seems to believe some same fundamental beliefs in Christianity. Whether they'll be judged or forgiven for believing in other gods which indirectly refers to our Christian God is not for me to say.

    God Blessed our souls.
    Ask and You shall receive,
    Seek and You shall find,
    Knock and the door will be open unto You.

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