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  1. #1
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    What are the unambiguous statements in the Bible?

    Since much confusion comes from ambiguity, what statements are there in the Bible that we can all agree on and we can all say are unambiguous?


    "God is one", to me, is an unambiguous statement, but to others "one" represents a Trinity, therefore that phrase is made ambiguous. When Jesus says; "I and my Father are one" the same use of the word "one" here introduces ambiguity in the first quote that I considered unambiguous.

    The following passages from Isaiah to me are unambiguous, but someone else is likely to disagree.

    Isa 45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.

    or

    Isa 45:21
    Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.



    Please put forward any statement from the Bible which you regard as unambiguous and let see who agrees. Let us see whether we can build on a foundation of unambiguous statements from the Bible.


    David

  2. #2
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    David M:
    The following passages from Isaiah to me are unambiguous, but someone else is likely to disagree.

    Isa 45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
    unambiguous? God is a Spirit..... Not sure how god can have 'hands'.... The language of Isa. is Eastern Oriental Metaphoric Hebraic language speak style.
    Brother Les

  3. #3
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    God is Spirit

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Les View Post
    unambiguous? God is a Spirit..... Not sure how god can have 'hands'.... The language of Isa. is Eastern Oriental Metaphoric Hebraic language speak style.
    Thank you Brother Les for being the first to start the replies. I think we should accept the statement you have given without further qualification. The same can be done with Jesus so as not to get into an argument over whether "Jesus is God", or the "Jesus is not God". We could all agree to call Jesus by the title 'Son of God' or 'Son of Man' and leave it at that.

    When God refers to ;"his arm" or "his hand" this is not necessarily a physical attribute, but a form of personification by which we can easily understand the workings of God. For an example Isa_62:8 The LORD hath sworn by his right hand, and by the arm of his strength, .....

    God does not need to have a body, but because body parts are mentioned, it is then argued that God is Spirit and is corporeal.

    http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/de...lish/corporeal
    adjective
    1 Relating to a personís body, especially as opposed to their spirit: he was frank about his corporeal appetites
    More example sentences
    1.1 Having a body: a corporeal God

    David

  4. #4
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    Here are a few unambiguous statements from the Bible:

    Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

    Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

    John 1:1,14-15 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.

    John 1:10-13 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

    Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

    Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.

    John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    Psalm 14:1 "The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God".


  5. #5
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    Thank you for the contribution. I am not going to get into any argument over verses that are in my opinion ambiguous. There will be by argument any verse taken to absurdem by splitting hairs. Certainly, to get to the understanding of any verse, the meanings of words have to be understood in the context the author used the word and intended his hearers to understand.

    We have the complication where translators might have done their best at the time to give us the best English, but since there is disagreement between scholars as to the best and most accurate translation, then it is better to leave such verses out. Such verses have become ambiguous and a subject of argument. For that reason, I simply indicate next to those you have selected the ones I agree are unambiguous. If someone else comes along and disagrees with my selection from those you have presented, then I would simply agree to remove those verses from the list of agreed verses. In this way, we should end up with a selection of verses we all agree are unambiguous.


    Quote Originally Posted by jce View Post
    Here are a few unambiguous statements from the Bible:

    Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. DM - Agree

    Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. DM - Agree

    John 1:1,14-15 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.

    John 1:10-13 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

    Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. DM - Agree

    John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. DM - Agree

    John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. DM - Agree

    Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. DM - Agree

    John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. DM - Agree

    Psalm 14:1 "The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God". DM - Agree


  6. #6
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    Hi David,

    Okay, here is my short list of what I believe to be some unambiguous statements from Yeshua:

    John 5:22
    22. For the Father judges no man, but has committed all judgment unto the Son:

    John 5:31
    31. If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

    John 8:15
    15. You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one.

    John 8:50
    50. And I seek not mine own glory: there is one Seeker and Judge.

    John 12:47-48
    47. And if anyone hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, contrariwise so that the world may be delivered.
    48. Him rejecting me, and receiving not my words, has one that judges him: the Logos that I have spoken, that one shall judge him in the last day.

    John 14:24
    24. Him not loving me keeps not my logous-words: and the Logos-Word which you hear is not of me, but-contrariwise, [it is of] the Sender of me, the Father.

    And here is one additional statement from Book of the Revelation of Messiah Yeshua:

    Revelation 19:11-13
    11 And I saw the heavens opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he does judge and make war.
    12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written that no man knew but he himself.
    13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Logos-Word of Elohim.


    And here is what I understand from these highly straightforward statements:

    1) The Father judges no one.
    2) The man Yeshua judges no one.
    3) The Logos spoken through Yeshua is the Seeker and the Judge.
    4) Therefore the Logos is the Son who descended in the bodily form of a dove.

    Behold, a sower went forth to sow, and in his hand was a toxon seed bow.

  7. #7
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    Hello Toxon

    Thank you for your input. With the references you have quoted, I agree with them all that they are unambiguous. However, it is up to someone else to say that they disagree with you and me and give reason why they disagree with any particular verse. It would appear from those verses that Yeshua is not Yahweh, not the Creator, and not the Father. The moment I say that, there will be those who say I am wrong. Therefore, they must disagree with the verses you have quoted, because they must say those verses are ambimguous for someone to think that they are confirming that Yeshua and Yahweh are equal and are one in the Trinity.

    Quote Originally Posted by toxon View Post
    Hi David,

    Okay, here is my short list of what I believe to be some unambiguous statements from Yeshua:

    John 5:22
    22. For the Father judges no man, but has committed all judgment unto the Son:

    John 5:31
    31. If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

    John 8:15
    15. You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one.

    John 8:50
    50. And I seek not mine own glory: there is one Seeker and Judge.

    John 12:47-48
    47. And if anyone hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, contrariwise so that the world may be delivered.
    48. Him rejecting me, and receiving not my words, has one that judges him: the Logos that I have spoken, that one shall judge him in the last day.

    John 14:24
    24. Him not loving me keeps not my logous-words: and the Logos-Word which you hear is not of me, but-contrariwise, [it is of] the Sender of me, the Father.

    And here is one additional statement from Book of the Revelation of Messiah Yeshua:

    Revelation 19:11-13
    11 And I saw the heavens opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he does judge and make war.
    12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written that no man knew but he himself.
    13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Logos-Word of Elohim.


    And here is what I understand from these highly straightforward statements:

    1) The Father judges no one.
    2) The man Yeshua judges no one.
    3) The Logos spoken through Yeshua is the Seeker and the Judge.
    4) Therefore the Logos is the Son who descended in the bodily form of a dove.
    Whilst I agree with the references you have given and say they are unambiguous, I can also agree with three out of four of your summary statements. At this point in time, I think it would make for a subject on its own for discussion centred on your last statement. I will make a comment about this in the thread; 'Jesus is not God'. I will leave you to start a new thread to discuss this thought you have.

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