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Thread: Job 1

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post
    Matthew or 1John
    Have you read the chapters in my book where I show the connections?
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    Have you read the chapters in my book where I show the connections?
    I bought the book and must have read it but gave it to someone else.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post
    I bought the book and must have read it but gave it to someone else.
    Well, most of the essential material is available online. Just click on Spoke 18. It shows how Job, Matthew, and 1 John are profoundly integrated with the primary meaning of the 18th letter Tzaddi (Righteousness).
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    Well, most of the essential material is available online. Just click on Spoke 18. It shows how Job, Matthew, and 1 John are profoundly integrated with the primary meaning of the 18th letter Tzaddi (Righteousness).
    Your link sends to the localhost.
    But I find some books can clearly divide the chapters to the pattern of the innerwheels. Or the book of Jonah shows a pattern of similar phrases between 1 and 3 and then 2 and 4, at least the chaptering of the Masoretic Text.
    More on Jonah
    Last edited by gilgal; 11-11-2011 at 03:38 AM.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post
    Your link sends to the localhost.
    But I find some books can clearly divide the chapters to the pattern of the innerwheels. Or the book of Jonah shows a pattern of similar phrases between 1 and 3 and then 2 and 4, at least the chaptering of the Masoretic Text.
    More on Jonah
    Doh! I was working on my localhost and inadvertantly took the link for there (it looks like the live site). Here is the corrected link: Spoke 18.

    Yes, the chapter sequences (Innner Cycles) of some books do have some striking connections with the Wheel - the book of Isaiah is the most stunning example of this. But the Inner Cycles are a secondary phenomenon not nearly as impressive, convincing, or significant as the Bible Wheel itself. This is because they are not found in all the books, and they aer based on the chapter sequences which are a very late addition to the Bible and have more of an "arbitrary" sense about them than the book order (though most skeptics insist both are arbitrary). And they are simply less "lucid" than the main pattern of books on the Bible Wheel and are more difficult to understand for most people. And it's more difficult to discern between chance and design. This is why it has always seemed odd that you focus almost entirely upon the Inner Cycle. I'm now getting the impression that you don't even think the pattern of the Bible Wheel is very significant, and that all the really important stuff is found by comparing chapter sequences of books. Is this correct?
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    Doh! :doh: I was working on my localhost and inadvertantly took the link for there (it looks like the live site). Here is the corrected link: Spoke 18.

    Yes, the chapter sequences (Innner Cycles) of some books do have some striking connections with the Wheel - the book of Isaiah is the most stunning example of this. But the Inner Cycles are a secondary phenomenon not nearly as impressive, convincing, or significant as the Bible Wheel itself. This is because they are not found in all the books, and they aer based on the chapter sequences which are a very late addition to the Bible and have more of an "arbitrary" sense about them than the book order (though most skeptics insist both are arbitrary). And they are simply less "lucid" than the main pattern of books on the Bible Wheel and are more difficult to understand for most people. And it's more difficult to discern between chance and design. This is why it has always seemed odd that you focus almost entirely upon the Inner Cycle. I'm now getting the impression that you don't even think the pattern of the Bible Wheel is very significant, and that all the really important stuff is found by comparing chapter sequences of books. Is this correct?
    I underlined and marked footnotes and passages in my bible. There are pages that show a lot of underlining and pages that show hardly any.

    Revelation was perhaps the 1st book which proved the biblewheel and guess what, I didn't learn it on your site although it was more detailed. I learned it from JR Church's Prophecy In The News Magazine. But he never concluded in the form that you suggested that the bible is divided in 3 sets/cycles of 22 books.

    My first attempt to find patterns is find alphabetic keywords. Even though it may be a coincidence, it's a start.

    The next step is to find/recall similar phrases in other passages or look at the footnotes/cross references already in your bible.

    The significant links most probably have phrases including an alphabetic keyword. Or it would have an alphabetic keyword with a group of other words which go along with it such as table and chair.

    And if you're thinking as to what kind of words to search, look at the alphabetic poetry in the bible such as Psalm 119 or Lamentations for some hints.
    Last edited by gilgal; 11-12-2011 at 11:37 PM.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post
    Revelation was perhaps the 1st book which proved the biblewheel and guess what, I didn't learn it on your site although it was more detailed. I learned it from JR Church's Prophecy In The News Magazine. But he never concluded in the form that you suggested that the bible is divided in 3 sets/cycles of 22 books.
    It sounds like you are talking about his book The Mystery of the Menorah ... and the Hebrew Alphabet. He compared the 22 letters with the 22 chapters of Revelation. His treatment is pretty superficial, but he saw many of the obvious "hits" - such as Christ identifying himself as "Alpha and Omega" in chapter 1 (Aleph), and Chapter 4 opens with reference to a door (Dalet) being open in heaven, and so forth. But he made huge errors when he tried to force-fit the Bible onto the pattern of the alphabet because he did not accept the Bible as given (as is typical for Bibilcal fundamentalists) but argued rather for the "ancient form" because the Jews tried to force-fit it into a pattern of 22 books to fit the alphabet. His scheme failed miserably and utterly destroyed most of the real connections between the letters and books. This is why he never discovered the Bible Wheel - he didn't accept the Bible as given and started with the false assumption about the "ancient form" of the OT.

    And then he compounded his error by aligning the NT with the 27 Hebrew letters by including the five final forms. This destroyed all the connections between the letters and the books. And it shows how anyone can find patterns in anything which is a primary argument used against all these kinds of projects. The fact that the world - especially the religious world - is filled with sloppy thinking and erroneous "pattern finding" made it essentially impossible for me to get any rational hearing for my work on the Bible Wheel. The skeptics had good reason to ignore it as the work of another foolish religious crank finding patterns in clouds and burnt toast.

    Quote Originally Posted by gilgal View Post

    And if you're thinking as to what kind of words to search, look at the alphabetic poetry in the bible such as Psalm 119 or Lamentations for some hints.
    Yes, of course. The Alphabetic Verses like Psalm 119 are the very foundation of my book! Maybe you should read it sometime.
    • Skepticism is the antiseptic of the mind.
    • Remember why we debate. We have nothing to lose but the errors we hold. Who but a stubborn fool would hold to errors once they have been exposed?

    Check out my blog site

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAM View Post
    It sounds like you are talking about his book The Mystery of the Menorah ... and the Hebrew Alphabet. He compared the 22 letters with the 22 chapters of Revelation. His treatment is pretty superficial, but he saw many of the obvious "hits" - such as Christ identifying himself as "Alpha and Omega" in chapter 1 (Aleph), and Chapter 4 opens with reference to a door (Dalet) being open in heaven, and so forth. But he made huge errors when he tried to force-fit the Bible onto the pattern of the alphabet because he did not accept the Bible as given (as is typical for Bibilcal fundamentalists) but argued rather for the "ancient form" because the Jews tried to force-fit it into a pattern of 22 books to fit the alphabet. His scheme failed miserably and utterly destroyed most of the real connections between the letters and books. This is why he never discovered the Bible Wheel - he didn't accept the Bible as given and started with the false assumption about the "ancient form" of the OT.

    And then he compounded his error by aligning the NT with the 27 Hebrew letters by including the five final forms. This destroyed all the connections between the letters and the books. And it shows how anyone can find patterns in anything which is a primary argument used against all these kinds of projects. The fact that the world - especially the religious world - is filled with sloppy thinking and erroneous "pattern finding" made it essentially impossible for me to get any rational hearing for my work on the Bible Wheel. The skeptics had good reason to ignore it as the work of another foolish religious crank finding patterns in clouds and burnt toast.


    Yes, of course. The Alphabetic Verses like Psalm 119 are the very foundation of my book! Maybe you should read it sometime.
    It's true that him along with others anticipate things trying to fit in with the hebrew alphabet in the final form. But give them credit that there is an effort to understand the connection of the books with the alphabet.

    When I found your site a little after that it was by accident. I was actually searching something random, I believe the Jewish feasts or the menorah or something.

    But a few of the Revelation chapters opened with the word of the consecutive letter such as Revelation 4 starts with A door Daleth being the 4th letter, Revelation 13 A beast came out of the sea Mayim being the 13th letter.

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