The Origin of Matter and Information

[Rose]

Since man is created in the image of God, and all of man's abilities, including that of imagination, are part of the package, it would mean that there is nothing impossible, if it can be imagined, for the thought that inspires the imagination originates from God who is unlimited in His creative abilities. We are still growing and learning and with that thought in mind, will there be an end to learning? I think not because I believe in God.

"And God said, Let us make man in our imagination and in the imagination of God created He him, male and female created He them"

"And man said, Let us create God in our imagination and in the imagination of man created he him, male and female created he them".

Happy imagining to all of you dreamers out there and by all means... Dream Big!!!! Because our God is Great!!!

John

If history is our record there should be no end to learning. From the origins of life 3.8 billion years ago there has been a steady progression of growth, and from the time that humans split on the tree of life from primates 6 million years ago there has been a increase in knowledge and learning...so, we have a long history that promotes the idea of DREAMING BIG!!!!!

Rose

[David M]

Hi to all

I am not going to speculate what might have been at or before the beginning of everything. Understanding the very beginning of everything is as impossible as grasping infinity.

I do not pretend to be a linguistics scholar but point out the simplest of answers to explain the beginning of what we can see. It seems appropriate to throw this into this thread.

Our word universe simply means uni (one) verse (word or phrase). The Bible has given us the answer;

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God

From what I have read in other threads on this forum the complete phrase; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. using Hebrew Gematria reveals the divine stamp of the Creator in the phrase. Until recently, I had not appreciated the full beauty that Gematria brings to this phrase. Richard, in his the Bible Wheel website has given us an explanation of Gematria.

Another website you can easily find by doing a Google search is this: [URL="http://www.palmoni.net/gematria.htm"]http://www.palmoni.net/gematria.htm which shows the number 7 as a pervasive number throughout the Gematria of this phrase.

Numbers in the Bible have their own significance and the number '7' is associated with completeness. With this in mind, this phrase; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth gives us completeness i.e. all we need to know. What God has not reveled belongs to Him as He has told us.



David

[Richard Amiel McGough]

Hi to all

I am not going to speculate what might have been at or before the beginning of everything. Understanding the very beginning of everything is as impossible as grasping infinity.

I do not pretend to be a linguistics scholar but point out the simplest of answers to explain the beginning of what we can see. It seems appropriate to throw this into this thread.

Our word universe simply means uni (one) verse (word or phrase). The Bible has given us the answer;

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God

From what I have read in other threads on this forum the complete phrase; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. using Hebrew Gematria reveals the divine stamp of the Creator in the phrase. Until recently, I had not appreciated the full beauty that Gematria brings to this phrase. Richard, in his the Bible Wheel website has given us an explanation of Gematria.

Another website you can easily find by doing a Google search is this: [URL="http://www.palmoni.net/gematria.htm"]http://www.palmoni.net/gematria.htm which shows the number 7 as a pervasive number throughout the Gematria of this phrase.

Numbers in the Bible have their own significance and the number '7' is associated with completeness. With this in mind, this phrase; In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth gives us completeness i.e. all we need to know. What God has not reveled belongs to Him as He has told us.



David

Hey there David,

The alphanumeric structure of Genesis 1:1 remains one of the mysteries that keeps me wondering about the origin of the Bible. It certainly looks like it was designed by a very intelligent being. But then when I read the text, I immediately am confounded because I know that God did not create "the heaven and the earth" in the "beginning." On the contrary, the earth came into existence about 4.5 billion years ago, whereas the "beginning" (Big Bang) happened about 13.7 billion years ago. So I am immediately confronted with a contradiction - the text appears to be designed, but what it says is not true.

And then the problem is quickly amplified as I read just a little further int the text. There is no such thing as a "firmament" that "divides the waters above from the waters below." That is just the old three-tier universe with a "dome" above a "flat earth" that was common in the mythological cosmology of the ancient Near East. And then I read just a little further, and encounter the absurd idea that the sun, moon, and stars were made on the Fourth Day, after the earth! It seems obvious to me that no amount of "design" in the alphanumeric structure of Genesis 1:1 can trump the errors of the plain text. So it's a mystery to me, and I can't see how any explanations could every fix the errors in the text of Genesis 1 unless, of course, we deny it is literal and choose to take it figuratively. But that is of little interest to me, since I don't feel like making up my own interpretation of the text.

All the best,

Richard

[jce]

Just thinking.

What if the fundamental particles of nature were actually tiny living creatures carrying out orders delivered by the Creator? Their function would be to interact with each other in such a way as to materialize.

The implications of such an idea are far reaching, including the opening of a door to the "spiritual realm" where manifestations could suddenly appear and disappear in an instant. A world where miracles are nothing more, and nothing less, than the result of particles rearranging themselves to fulfill a command. In effect, all creation would be subject to His will, excepting of course, those particles in rebellion.

It is, at the very least, a simple, understandable concept.

God is Great!

John

[Richard Amiel McGough]

Just thinking.

What if the fundamental particles of nature were actually tiny living creatures carrying out orders delivered by the Creator? Their function would be to interact with each other in such a way as to materialize.

The implications of such an idea are far reaching, including the opening of a door to the "spiritual realm" where manifestations could suddenly appear and disappear in an instant. A world where miracles are nothing more, and nothing less, than the result of particles rearranging themselves to fulfill a command. In effect, all creation would be subject to His will, excepting of course, those particles in rebellion.

It is, at the very least, a simple, understandable concept.

God is Great!

John

Hi John,

That's an interesting approach, but I don't see how giving the particles agency would really help anything. Couldn't we arrive at the same result through the traditional understanding of God as all-powerful? He "gives the command" and things happen accordingly.

When I was a Christian, I thought of the world as a thought in the mind of God. I saw the natural laws merely as the result of the fact that God's thoughts are very consistent. He could cause things to pop in and out of existence at will, but he doesn't usually act that way. I'm still inclined towards the "Idealist" view of reality in which consciousness/mind is the ground of being, but I don't think of it as Theism where God is an agent who goes about doing things like any other bit player in the cosmic drama. That idea doesn't make any sense to me, and it seems totally contrary to the way the world works. There is no evidence of any kind that there is a God who cares about what we do and intervenes in our affairs. If he exists, he has chosen to do everything possible to make it seem he does not exist. So if that's his will, who am I to defy him and say he exists?

Richard

[jce]

Hi John,

That's an interesting approach, but I don't see how giving the particles agency would really help anything. Couldn't we arrive at the same result through the traditional understanding of God as all-powerful? He "gives the command" and things happen accordingly.

Richard

Hi Richard

Hope all is well!

The idea that led me to consider agency was the simplicity of it. It would certainly lend understanding to activities taking place in quantum mechanics and perhaps shed some light on the possibility of a spiritual dimension.

I don't disagree with the conventional approach to creation, but hey, let's face it... man has a long way to go in his pursuit of a unifying theory, and if we don't live forever, you and I are going to get kicked out of the theater before the end of the movie.

God's best to you Richard. Always good to chat!

John

[Richard Amiel McGough]

Hi Richard

Hope all is well!

The idea that led me to consider agency was the simplicity of it. It would certainly lend understanding to activities taking place in quantum mechanics and perhaps shed some light on the possibility of a spiritual dimension.

I don't disagree with the conventional approach to creation, but hey, let's face it... man has a long way to go in his pursuit of a unifying theory, and if we don't live forever, you and I are going to get kicked out of the theater before the end of the movie.

God's best to you Richard. Always good to chat!

John

Hey there John,

This is a fun topic you introduced. And yes, we have much to learn!

I think we might find more light if I thought of "elementary particles" as the very "stuff of God" as opposed to created living beings. I mean, energy can be thought of ultimately as light, and light is a very good metaphor for God. Perhaps we are really "seeing God" when we see anything at all.

Great chatting,

Richard

[jce]

Hey there John,

This is a fun topic you introduced. And yes, we have much to learn!

I think we might find more light if I thought of "elementary particles" as the very "stuff of God" as opposed to created living beings. I mean, energy can be thought of ultimately as light, and light is a very good metaphor for God. Perhaps we are really "seeing God" when we see anything at all.

Great chatting,

Richard

We need a "Like" link on posts so viewers could agree with a comment.

I "Like" your premise!

John

[duxrow]

We need a "Like" link on posts so viewers could agree with a comment.

I "Like" your premise!

John

Great subject. Overwhelming too!

"Anybody out there??"

[CWH]

We need a "Like" link on posts so viewers could agree with a comment.

I "Like" your premise!

John

Forget about the "Like" button; based on experience, surveys and questionnaires don't work in this forum. And hardly anyone used the thread ratings in this forum, not to say the "Like" button. Furthermore, the "Like" or "Unlike" button can be misused, same as the thread ratings.

God Blessed.