What is "This Generation?"

[whirlwind]

At least you are partially correct. Christ did make it very clear that the buildings of the Temple would be destroyed, and his words came to pass in 70 AD as everyone knows. Even you have to admit these facts.

I'm glad you now ADMIT it is the "buildings of the temple," and NOT the temple, as you have been saying over and over and over again.... under discussion.

And you also have to admit that the "world" of the first covenant age ended in the first century. Therefore history confirms the fulfillment of his great prophecy.

The world didn't end nor did the age end in 70AD. The buildings of the temple had nothing to do with either.

Let us be thankful to the Lord that he made his word so plain and simple that even a child could understand it!

And yes, yes, yes! Let us accept what is written!

I wait for your acceptance of that very thing "dear friend."



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[Brother Les]

Whirlwind
I stand by that. Jesus Himself told us that there would be a time when "not one stone upon another" would be "here," which is where the "buildings of the temple" are. They still stand. That is what cannot be interpreted to mean something else. It is what it is...one huge wall of stones standing one upon another. There still being there isn't up for grabs...they stand. What can be interpreted is the meaning of the stones for they are symbolic of more than rocks. But, those they are symbolic of also still stand...for a time.

Your words have reinforce what I said on another thread. Yes, the 'stones' are more than just ,mere rocks. They represent the Foundation of the Old Mosaic Cultus World Covenant Marriage of Death and all of the elements of that 'world'. As The Hebrew writer stated, as long as the Tabernacle (and you see that represented by the 'Wailing Wall' stones) was Standing, it Had Standing. ie every Jot and Tittle of The Law and Prophets were in Full Force for 'Israel' and her prosylites. And it is only 'Israel' that can recieve the New Covenant Blessings of Marriage as His Church (Body).




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Originally Posted by whirlwind


I quoted HIS WORDS...you must come to terms with them.

A) You quote 'words' from one version of the Bible and disregard others (Youngs).

B) You have not proven that those 'stones' from the 'wailing Wall', that are over 100 yards from where Harods Temple stood, are in fact the same 'stones' that Jesus was indicating over 2,000 years ago to come down.

C) If those are the 'Stones' that have not been pulled down from one on top of an other, then those worshiping at The Wailing Wall are the only rightful and only Heirs (as Israel) to the New Covenant Promises, proclaimed to be given at 'The End of The Age'.

D) If you stand by 'the stones still standing', then 'the Stones' Still Have the Standing of why they were to come down. You may disregard the Stone Temple of the Mosaic Cultus Age, but you can not disregard the Sinia Betrothal of the Mosaic Age. That World/Age has never ended and never will as long as 'The Stones' (of The Temple and its' complex) still stand.

E) You are Dead in your Sins and will never gain Righteousness and go straight to Sheol at your physical death, because the way to the Holy of Holies are still closed to you, because 'the stones' (in your paradygm) are still upon one another. The Blood of The Lamb covers all Sins, but only the Election are raised from the Sheol/Hell/Paradise at The End of The Age and this is only the Election Remnent of Israel and it prosylites. If you do not worship at the 'Wailing Wall' then you are no 'Prosylite' and are of no part of 'Israel', under the 'stones' prophecy paradiym. From dust you came and to dust you shall go, but never to the Holy of Holies and to The Face of Jesus/YHWH
__________________
Brother Les

[whirlwind]

Your words have reinforce what I said on another thread. Yes, the 'stones' are more than just ,mere rocks. They represent the Foundation of the Old Mosaic Cultus World Covenant Marriage of Death and all of the elements of that 'world'. As The Hebrew writer stated, as long as the Tabernacle (and you see that represented by the 'Wailing Wall' stones) was Standing, it Had Standing. ie every Jot and Tittle of The Law and Prophets were in Full Force for 'Israel' and her prosylites. And it is only 'Israel' that can recieve the New Covenant Blessings of Marriage as His Church (Body).

It is good to agree on some things even if not all. I don't see them as you do Brother Les. They, to me, are false prophets, antichrists, still standing among God's children while they deceive.


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[Twospirits]

BL wrote,

But what is your 'take' (at this time) on the 'one stone on another' verse and the view point of the 'Wailing Wall'?

My "take" doesn't matter here, its you and others vs. Whirlwind's position that matters in this discussion of what was and was not fulfilled concerning "the buildings of the temple."

God bless---Twospirits

[TheForgiven]

Preconceived? A conflict with the text?
Matthew 24:1-3 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and His disciples came to Him for to shew Him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as He sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of Thy coming, and of the end of the world?
What conflict with the text are you speaking of? The end of the world/age or the sign of His coming or the one stone upon another? And by the way....you didn't see any interpretation nor did you see any of my words. You see THE WORDS OF THE LORD. Deal with them!

Gotcha! You went EXACTLY where I thought you would go. Now compare Matthew’s account with that of Luke’s, and you will see that Luke's account is no different than Matthew's.

Luke 21: 5-6 Then, as some spoke of the temple, how it was adorned with beautiful stones and donations, He said, 6 “These things which you see—the days will come in which not one stone shall be left upon another that shall not be thrown down.”

Luke and Matthew make absolutely NO mention of the foundation, western wall, outer court, or any other place EXCEPT the temple and its decorations. The Apostles were showing Christ the beautiful decorations and stones ON THE TEMPLE. The wailing wall is not part of the temple; furthermore, it may not even be Jewish. Studies of this wall are currently showing that the wailing wall was a wall built by Hadrian for the Roman Fort Antonia, which was used to keep the Barbarians out. Plus, the wailing wall was never considered a Jewish site until the 16th century. Lastly, the location of the wailing wall was used by Christians for more than 1000 years as a trash dump. It wasn’t until the 16th century that secular Jews moved the location of prayer to the wailing wall, and all based on a false premise.

At any rate, your “inference” that “one stone upon another” must mean every aspect of Jerusalem's buildings does not match the subject matter of the Temple Stones and its decoration. You’re usurping an interpretation (non-written interpretation) that the “wailing wall” is part of the temple, but that is not what the Apostles were looking at. Jesus only responded to what they were looking at, but you’re inferring that Jesus was referring to everything (structure) around them. THAT is an inference based on an opinion with no factual basis.

You are dead wrong, and it’s crazy to assume that the temple hasn’t been destroyed because of a wall that:

1. Has nothing to do with Herods temple
2. Was never even part of the Apostles discussion
3. Was not looked at, or admired by the Apostles
4. Never made “DIRECT” mentioning by Christ

So your theory is nothing more than a loop-hole attempt to excuse the 70AD significance of the temple’s destruction. It’s as though you’ve rejected any Biblical significance of the horrible events of 70AD.

Weird is all I can say…very weird.

Joe

[Brother Les]

My "take" doesn't matter here, its you and others vs. Whirlwind's position that matters in this discussion of what was and was not fulfilled concerning "the buildings of the temple."

God bless---Twospirits

I had an idea that you would say something to that effect. If I searched hard enough I am sure I will find your leanings on the subject, but as of now we will leave as it is.

We are all 'Preterists' (past fulfillment) to a degree, but where that degree line is, is shifting as our paradiyms change.

Blessings Henry.

[Tomret]

A few things to consider are....one, he no longer tells us Christ prophesied of the destruction of "the temple." He is now properly saying it was the buildings of the temple....BIG, BIG DIFFERENCE.

Since anytime the destruction of the 'temple' was mentioned you countered with the true temple still stands, it became necessary to specifically designate the physical stone temple. That's the reason we use 'buildings of the temple' from the verses or 'man made' or 'physical,' etc. But, the 'buildings of the temple' WERE the component parts of the temple. There was no temple with a bunch of outbuildings scattered about the mount. There were the inner/outer courts, porches, men's court, women's court, baths, holy of holies etc. Those were the 'buildings of the temple.'

[Twospirits]

BL wrote,

I had an idea that you would say something to that effect. If I searched hard enough I am sure I will find your leanings on the subject, but as of now we will leave as it is.

We are all 'Preterists' (past fulfillment) to a degree, but where that degree line is, is shifting as our paradiyms change.

Les, I have told you where I stand on the Discourse on the AV forum, remember? I just didn't want to get into "my position" at this time. At this time it is Whirlwind's position the readers want to hear from, not mine.

God bless---Twospirits

[Rose]

Preconceived? A conflict with the text?

Matthew 24:1-3 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and His disciples came to Him for to shew Him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as He sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of Thy coming, and of the end of the world?

What conflict with the text are you speaking of? The end of the world/age or the sign of His coming or the one stone upon another? And by the way....you didn't see any interpretation nor did you see any of my words. You see THE WORDS OF THE LORD. Deal with them!





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When a person sees words written on a page the first thing that has to be done is to interpret what those words mean, and as has been shown over and over again on this Forum, the very same words in the very same text are interpreted to mean something entirely different to each person who's interpreting them.

There is no such thing as THE WORDS OF THE LORD! Every word you see is one that was written by a human, and is being interpreted by a human!

Blessings,
Rose

[Richard Amiel McGough]

At least you are partially correct. Christ did make it very clear that the buildings of the Temple would be destroyed, and his words came to pass in 70 AD as everyone knows. Even you have to admit these facts.

I'm glad you now ADMIT it is the "buildings of the temple," and NOT the temple, as you have been saying over and over and over again.... under discussion.

I never have and never will "admit" such a ridiculous falsehood. You are directly contradicting the hundreds of verses in the Bible that call the physical Temple building made of stones by human hands the "Temple." We need but one verse to settle this issue:

1 Kings 6:7 And the temple, when it was being built, was built with stone finished at the quarry, so that no hammer or chisel or any iron tool was heard in the temple while it was being built.

Your refusal to admit this simple an incontrovertible fact demonstrates with total and finality the falsehood of your claims.

So now that you have been absolutely refuted by the Holy Bible, will you answer my question?

WHY DID JESUS PREDICT THE DESTRUCTION OF THE TEMPLE BUILDINGS IF THEIR DESTRUCTION IN 70 AD HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH HIS PROPHECY?

Thanks!

Richard