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  1. #71
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by Gil View Post
    No wisdom given ,
    Just rambling for the fun of it.

    Well, I'm one of not to many that looks at Scripture from a more allegorical position.
    The Bible being the word of God given to Man. I don't see any other living things created that are able to have a meaningful relationship with God other than Man.

    Science is moving ever deeper into the meta physical world of things not seen. What are thoughts and concepts but a backward movement from the physical to the mental to the spiritual.

    I live in a house. I built my house. I designed and drew up the blueprints my self. The concept as seen in my mind came first. Without life I would not have had the concept. I spoke my own word. Gil, go get your hammer and nails.
    Did I have Faith? Yes and it passed all inspections.

    Reminds me of the alchemists fire, air, water and earth. Scientists moving from earth backward to fire along with the theological counterparts. In the elemental progression they say fire can destroy the air but the air cannot destroy the fire, the air can destroy the water but the water cannot destroy the air, the water can destroy the earth but the earth cannot destroy the water.

    The Bible is filled with dualism , opposites and types and archetypes Shadows of reality ,good and evil, darkness and light.
    Angels and demons and the hiding places of spirits.

    I only see two major players in the Bible and they are God and Man.

    Hence there are two speakers to be heard. God and Man. It says discern the Spirits. In the end there are only two.
    The Spirit of Man and the Spirit of God.
    You see a power struggle between God and Man, between the creator and the created.

    They say that the earth was destroyed by water. Maybe , but what does that have to do with mans relationship to God through his Spirit and the present BOC?
    There was an age of the dinosaurs and early man. Man was told to replenish the earth with his own kind.
    Shift in the earths axis, the ice age or some other catastrophic event are all pretty much assumed.
    Young earth, old earth, local flood ,global flood. What of Noah?
    There is mentioned the early day rain and latter day rain. If there is the water of life there has to be the water of death. What can destroy the water of life? Nothing. Can it be that the fiery breath of God (Word) evaporates the water seen as Death?

    I kind of like EndtimesDeut32 closing statement in all his posts.
    "I came back to you like this" he said to those around him, "so that you would know my words of life are true, and therefore my words of absence of life are also true. "The Outlaw", Jesus Christ John 3:15-18

    However death is only the absence of life. The word of God also purifies like that of a refiners furnace. Weird how the three thrown into the fiery furnace did not die.
    Isn't the Holy Spirit considered to be as fire. Are we not baptized by fire?
    If the later day rain is being poured out by the Spirit of life, the Father ,the Lord of our Lord Christ Jesus are we to be saved like in the days of Noah? Well. we have an Ark also.
    Can mans word be as water? Man developed a spirit ,so can his spirit begin to make it rain until it becomes a flood?
    Eno's was a frail man and he first started calling on the name of God. The Gods name was Jehovah. Why did Enoch the prophet, prophesy against Enos?
    The rainbow covenant just came to mind. The colors of a rainbow remind me of the coat of many colors that Joseph would wear.
    The earth and heaven (the Hebrew world) was to be destroyed by fire. Do you suppose that the Holy Spirit done this?
    He is as a flaming fire. How is chaff and wheat separated on the threshing floor. By the wind. Can not the wind be the word of God as it is breathed and is not the stubble burned?
    If the Spirit (fire) breathes (air) the word (water) unto the (earth) something is going to happen.

    Well my rambling ends for another day. Time to eat supper or do they call it dinner now?
    We are not in the last days, we are in the Day of the Lord.
    The BOC is the new creation.

    Hi Gil,
    Very good rambling. Lot of wisdom there. I agree with pretty much everything you said except,.. what is BOC?

    Oh, ok body of Christ! I was tired last night.
    Last edited by Bob May; 09-22-2010 at 06:40 AM.

  2. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Gil View Post
    No wisdom given ,

    I kind of like EndtimesDeut32 closing statement in all his posts.
    "I came back to you like this" he said to those around him, "so that you would know my words of life are true, and therefore my words of absence of LIFE (with the Creator) are also true. "The Outlaw", Jesus Christ John 3:15-18
    In case you haven't picked up on it yet; it is a loose parallel to the dialogue between the "outlaw" Josey Whales and Chief Ten Bears in the movie of the first characters name.

    Something like:
    "I came here like this so that you would know my words of life are true and so also my words of death are also true.".

    But most profound is the idea that Jesus resurrection gave the disciples and us unquestioning reason to place faith in the absolute authority and truthfulness of his words and teachings of LiFE through the love demonstrated by his coming back to them especially in their time of trial/doubt/questioning.

    They could look at him straight in the face and say...Hey.. remember when you told us this....or that.... was that true.....? To which, the presence of his resurrection would testify to the eternal truthfulness and authority of his words even without the need for an answer.

    Eventually, his words of judgment and death upon those of that generation of the mosaic covenant who hated him (the Creator/lawgiver/life) would also come true.

    The dual sides of his words come out in John 3:15-18 and 1st John (he who has the son has LIFE (with God), he who has not the son hath not LIFE)

    There is alot of historically political and spiritual underweavings in that movie.

    More sent in a PM.
    Last edited by EndtimesDeut32/70AD; 09-23-2010 at 05:45 AM. Reason: More sent in a PM
    1Thess 4:8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.
    If you are oppressed and enslaved by religious law, you may have a tendency to oppress, enslave and attempt to lord over others who are free.

  3. #73
    Join Date
    Apr 2009


    Howdy ETD32,

    Your post and Pm were appreciated.
    I agree with you completely.
    I picked up on the same thoughts when I watched the Movie.
    It was a classic. Also the catch phrase when the bounty hunter came
    after Josey and Josey asked him what he did for a living.
    The bounty hunter said it was hunting down men for money, that it was how he made his living.
    Josey's response, " I don't call dying much of a living".

    I had many Indian friends when I was growing up.
    They all spoke the truth as they knew the truth to be and
    if you lied to them ,you became an enemy.

    This is a pretty good forum. Small enough without hundreds of opinions
    all based upon the knowledge gained throughout their individual lifetime's
    and for the most part a collection of the opinions of others .
    At least here there are some who leave the box and are not afraid of unloading their new thoughts as to how they view the Bible as it has been handed down to us.
    Which is a good thing ,as it will be put to the test at least.

    As for me, have came full circle within the bible (IMO) . I started in Genesis with the old creation,the Garden and the first Adam ( OT) and ended in the
    ( NT) the new creation, the last Adam and the BOC.
    I looked at my position from my own point of view and to my own surprise had ended out where I started, back in the Garden once again.
    A circular journey of life - birth - death - birth - life.

    Guess this Subject brought up by Rose ," The Universe was Created to Design Itself", may have to have all the worms put back in the can. ( Creation vs evolution ) and be re evaluated.

    The Books of Genesis and Revelation are compliments of one another.
    They call them the beginning and the end.
    The beginning and end of what?
    What they call the old creation, was for man . Creation from a biblical POV (point of view), that is the six days, culminated with Adam. It was Adam that was to be created.
    The old creation was finished in Adam.
    In lay terms, using building blocks until the creation was finished.
    So couldn't the old creation be seen as being Adam himself (male and female)?
    After all, in the plan and purpose for creation , it was Adam (Man) who was purposed.
    Are not the generations of Adam ( Given as the first parents of the children that would become Israel) the whole of the individuals that was called Adam?

    I was going to make associations with the new creation, but find myself off topic already.
    Sorry about that Rose.

    " The Universe was Created to Design Itself"

    It has been a while since I looked Genesis over.
    I'm a firm believer in the schools of Science and also what is written within our Bible.
    If we look at it from both points of view they have to be in agreement.
    The king James is what I have and think it is the best. The other translations incorporate wording to fit a given perspective ,be it a denomination or modern flat earth society.
    The English words even in the King James have been a bad choice at times
    ( IMO). One thing for sure is that they didn't have a modern scientific vocabulary to look at.

    Every time I go back and look at anything anymore, the picture that I have painted for myself starts to have runs and needs touching up.
    I can't read or write Greek and Hebrew but can use dictionary's , lexicons and such.
    I'm afraid it is going to be a new interpretation in many cases as to what thoughts and concepts did the translators miss in their use of Hebrew, Greek and English words.
    Hebrew will be the hardest .
    If the Bible is the inspired word of God, then the answers will have to follow the advances in science. Neither science or the Bible should have to prove themselves. They have to be in agreement.
    They probably are.
    Rose, you picked a tricky subject.

    Keep up the posting. I for one have to put my thinking cap back on.


  4. #74
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by Rose View Post
    As my transformation of thought continues, I am striving to come up with a descriptive term that best reflects my view of where I’m at in my faith….Realist seems most appropriate at this point in my journey, because it reflects the approach I use in determining how to interpret not only Scripture, but the world around me. The words of Romans 1: 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:” are more alive to me than ever before. Through the discoverability of the world around me and my ability to use reason, and logic I am able to hear God speak through all of creation, thus allowing myself the freedom to perceive truth from everything that exists in the Universe….whether that be the process of evolution or the contradictions of the Bible, I am free to look at the facts and use my reason to understand them, thus giving God the freedom in my mind to have created the universe anyway He desired.


    All the Best,

    Hi Rose and others,

    Think you need this info, think it makes sense. I haven't read the whole thread but came across this info concerning the universe. It's from 'my professor' and I like to call it

    Our body in the universe and the universe in our body

    In our body is the ratio of taking breaths to heartbeats 1:4. When our heart beats four times, we take one breath. The hour is divided into 1080 parts, into “gelakim”. “Gelek” (8-30-100) means part. How? An hour has 60 minutes but that is according to another calculation, the one we use today. In one minute we have 72 pulse beats and take 18 breaths (72:18 = 1:4). So in one hour we take 60x18 = 1080 breaths, thus one hour is divided in 1080 parts.

    The blood is the red side, connected with the 4 opposite of the 1 of the breath side. Now Edom means red in Hebrew, and Adam has to do with that too (dam = blood). Those two work together, the lungs are connected to the heart as 1:4 and together they have total grip on our life.

    We take 1080 breath's in an hour and that means 24x1080 = 25,920 per day. This is exactly the amount of years of the circulation of the universe! This takes place in man every day! Here we see the relationship of man with universe. We deal with the whole universe everyday this way, the universe is not only outside of us. We are created in it and it appears to be created in us as well.

    When in early days they said that man was the center of the universe, they must have meant it this way. And it still is today, every individual is created this way. And when in early days they said that the earth is the center of the universe, could that be because our body withe these properties is build and maintained of products of earth and connects to a day on earth this way?

    It's only a lack of knowledge that conceals this I guess, but it's easy to understand I think, we don't need to be rocket scientists for that. In fact, a rocket scientist won't tell you this and an spaceman neither because they most likely don't know it themselves! Should you meet a scientist who has knowledge about the universe and claims that God does not exist, you can tell him about design now. I started this post with 1:4 and link it to Gen 2:2 where it forms the base of, see my earlier post here. This way we link this science also to the Bible, or better said, the Bible to science. You have to have a big imagination to think that a person had all this knowledge and wrote it down in the Bible the way we find it there.

    Also a precession cycle of 25,765 years goes around on the internet but I haven't figured out the difference with 25,920. Now I found some info on the Wikipedia page, looks like they don''t know it exactly?
    Astronomical value of the precession cycle
    "The duration of the precession cycle, the time it takes for the equinox to precess 360 degrees relative to the fixed stars, is often given as 25,920 or 26,000 years. In reality the exact duration cannot be given, as the rate of precession is changing over time. This speed is currently 243.8 microradians (50.3 arcseconds) per year which would give 25,765 years for one cycle to complete."
    'My professor' wrote about the 25,765 years and the Bible.
    The 26,000 may be clear to us: The gematria value of The Name is 26 (10-5-6-5), translated with Lord. 1000 is written as eleph (1-30-80), aleph is 1 and written the same.
    So 25,765 comes close to 26,000, but is 235 years short.
    The generation of Enosh arrives 235 years after Adam (Gen. 5:3-6, 130+105). At that time they started to "call upon the name of the Lord", but actually it says "read the name of the Lord" (Gen. 4:26). The translation lets it appear like they are doing something good, but it has to be read that they started to use the name of the Lord for the earth. According to tradition the look at the world changed there completely. And that's why the visible precession is only 25.765 years. The time of the 235 years before Enosh were like another world, the generation of Enosh caused a change in time.
    The word Enosh (1-50-6-300) comes from "being weak" and means "man". There are more associations but let's not get into that. Anashim (plural) is translated as "people". Adam is also translated as "man" but Adamites is not used for "people". Adam is man in the sphere of walking with God and Enosh is man in the sphere of what Gen. 4:26 describes.
    Notice that the word Enosh in word value comes close to 358 (and it's not the 359 either and 360 degrees neither. The 350 - 360 sphere).
    So now we have connected the Bible with 25,765 years also. This is another discovery channel don't you think?
    I believe the missing 80 years from 25,920 to the 26,000 years have to do with the 80 years in the life of Moses' biblical account. He sure has to do with the Lord. He is also the 26th from Adam in the line of generations, completing the Torah. This way the whole Torah has to do with the 26 of the universe and it is stated in the Zohar that the Lord our God looked into the Torah and created the universe. And then He hid Himself a bit. What automatically goes along with it is that the universe is made with the hebrew alphabet. The hebrew alphabet counts to 400. The 500 is seen as another dimension. When the 22 'letters' fullfill theirself, 22x22, they are at this border.

    I think it's very interesting to connect the times.

    Now let's conclude with something lighter:
    (new) Did you know that in 50 years time we all can have a light sabre? A light sabre cuts through pretty much anything. You can battle the bad guys with it, just like in Star Wars. You can look at it right now already and here it is. The design of the Light Sabre
    Last edited by NumberX; 04-27-2011 at 02:19 PM.

  5. #75
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    What's next? The next logical step can be that one likes to find out how the Hebrew relates to the physical world around us by gematria. We have heard things like "there is a spark of God in everything". Well, how? you may ask. Show me a spark. It's through His Word, the hebrew word, with it's gematria, we can explore it as we see above and read my other posts of snow and rain for example or about our body. It takes time and energy to explore, when we want to know it we don't need to spend time on discussing with others who are not interested in this field of research.

    It's like wanting to know what a tree is, wat wood is, what water is, what our hair is, what this is and that, learning about the basic things in the here and now. The gematria connections are not teached at school and most of this info we can't think of ourselves. But when we found it and learn and understand how logical it is where we link gematria to creation, we can discuss these findings with others who didn't spend time and energy in this field. We don't expect them to be silent then, or get stupid, but that reallly can happen! There is much to explore in this type of research. Have great discoveries!
    Last edited by NumberX; 10-28-2010 at 01:23 AM.

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