Torah Letter Count

[Richard Amiel McGough]

David brought up the question of the number of letters in the Torah, and why there was a difference between the list presented on aishdas.org and my database which is derived from the BHS (4th edition). I don't know which document aishdas used, but here is the results of a comparison I produced today:




In my analysis I found that four letters had exactly the same frequency as reported by aishdas, and ten had a difference between 1 and 3. So the documents are very close. But there is a big mystery concerning the distribution of Vav, Yod, Mem, Nun, and Tzaddi which have differences of 24, 34, 12, 21 and -90, respectively. The last value is very strange. I triple checked my results since it seems impossible that there could be a difference of 90 Tzaddis in the two documents. I suspect that the number reported by aishdas is a mistake.

So there's the data.

Richard

[RockGate]

I looked at your data. Of course, I can't compare my findings, but only for Genesis..since that is all I have in spreadsheet. But my findings from copying your database is 78,070 characters and 20,564 words. What is fascinating to me is that the word count is 52 more than the aishdas.org number. Your total number of characters off for the whole torah is 51. Perhaps a coincidence, don't know. But I'm forced to wonder if there is some kind of Jewish tradition going on here...perhaps with one of the names of God...since it is blasphemy to repeat it....perhaps it is blasphemy to count the letters? Just a wild guess....stab in the dark. The reason I wonder that is because Jhwh is 26 and 26 x 2 is 52. Could this have anything to do with the discrepency in word count?

BTW, I'm totally new to the Torah....could you tell me what BHS is? Thanks.

[RockGate]

All right, you seem to pooh pooh the prime number discovery I made. Ok, what about this one. You know Vernon Jenkins website, he shows that the first 8 letters of the torah are parametricly linked with 3 numbers 500, 105, and 99. He lists them this way

A=500
B=105
C=99

Here are 2 equations I figured out after 2 solid days of quite literally banging my head on a wall:

A(phi) = 2(B) + C

A(e) = 12(B) + C

I'll let you chew on that one.......see what you've got

PS, the first equation reaches a result within 5/100,000ths and the second is off by a mere 1/10,000ths

[RockGate]

If you have a pentagon with an overall height of 100 units from peak to midpoint of base, then the overall width is 105.14 units wide.

105.14 to 100

vs.

105.0 to 99

If you have a golden triangle of sides 500 units, the base would be 309 which is 2 x 105 + 99. Here we see pentagonal geometry interlinked into the first 8 words of the torah...which has 5 books..... PENTA...teuch.

[Richard Amiel McGough]

All right, you seem to pooh pooh the prime number discovery I made.

I haven't pooh-poohed it. I wrote a response to you but your email wouldn't receive it again, but this time it was for a different reason.

I looked at the picture but could not understand what the numbers meant. I understand that you put the first 34 verses in a circle, but I don't understand the meaning of the numbers in the three cells aligned with each verse. You said they are "unique prime factors" but they were neither unique nor all prime so I didn't know what you meant. Also, I didn't understand why the words "Second Day" and "Third Day" didn't line up with the verses describing those days. So I'll need a little more explanation.

Ok, what about this one. You know Vernon Jenkins website, he shows that the first 8 letters of the torah are parametricly linked with 3 numbers 500, 105, and 99. He lists them this way

A=500
B=105
C=99

Here are 2 equations I figured out after 2 solid days of quite literally banging my head on a wall:

A(phi) = 2(B) + C

A(e) = 12(B) + C

I'll let you chew on that one.......see what you've got

PS, the first equation reaches a result within 5/100,000ths and the second is off by a mere 1/10,000ths

I'm not familiar with the specific page of Vernon's site that you are referring to. Could you post the link?

I don't undestand what you mean by the letter A. You seem to be using it in two ways: once as a number A = 500 and again as a function A(phi). Could you explain what you mean?

Richard

[RockGate]

http://www.whatabeginning.com/Misc/Wonders/SA12.htm

Hope this is what you requested.

About the prime numbers, they are the numbers around the outside between the color bands. These numbers don't seem to be prime because they are the actual prime number....discarding all other numbers. For instance, 2 is the first prime number, so it is listed there as a "1". 3 is the 2nd prime number, 5 the third, 7 the fourth, 11 the 5th,.....and so on. Therefore, I am examining the torah word gematria from a puristic viewpoint...only prime numbers.

An interesting and reinforcing fact that I am on the right track in this regards is the use of the word 'towb' or good when the author/s of the Torah describe the days of creation. Look closely and you'll see that the 2nd day of creation is intentionally not mentioned as 'good'...only 'it was so'. However, there is 6 days of creation and 6 good's. This is because the 6th day has a 'good' and a 'very good'. Now, why is this encouraging to me?

The 2nd day is mentioned on verse 8, where the first day is verse 1, the third day verse 13, the 4th day is vs 19, the 5th day vs 23, and the 6th day vs 31. If you notice, these are all prime numbers except for day 2....verse 8. It was the day that was not "good". See this? Can you give me a better explanation not involving prime numbers?

The inner colored ring is the actual days color coded in the 7 ROYGBIV colors of the rainbow. The outer ring is similar, but are what I consider to be the cryptic days of creation involving an evening and a morning based on the unique prime factors per verse. Notice that each of these colors spans a black cluster and a white cluster of contiguous verses. The other larger colored numbers represent fibonnaci number sequences. There is a red fibonnaci sequence and a blue fibonnaci sequence. The other numbers between these fibonnaci sequence are also numbered.

I know it is a bit confusing a takes a great deal of thought. Believe me. I know. I don't expect you to have anything to say without a bit of introspection and analysis. I personally believe there is too many "coincidences" here that coincide with what I think of as cryptic clues in the common text script....clues to the larger underlying cryptic message or picture/s. Very similar to Vernon Jenkins site, but a bit different. His method does not seem to include the six days and 7th day of rest of creation. This does....and is simply a number pattern of prime numbers based on the simple gematria value of the words. This can all be easily proved or disproved. The analysis of the data is the only thing open for debate.

In a nutshell....the author of the torah presented a patterned cadence of the days of creation, and whoever set out the verse structure that matches the King James Version of the Bible either purposely or accidently created a verse spacing in relationship to the prime numbers that involves the fibonnaci sequence. The end of the 1st day is vs 5, 2nd day vs 8, and 3rd day verse 13. This pattern is interrupted here. Now, when the gematria calculations are performed and factors found, it is the 8th and 13th verses that are the first to not have unique prime factors. This would at first site suggest another 21 verses before the next one is found. However, the pattern is the fibonnaci sequence in verse 8, 5, 3, 2, 1, 1, 0....ending with verse 19 or 20. It would be between 20 and 21 if the black verse of 1 is counted in the sequence.

At verse 13 another fibonnaci sequence starts but is based on a different counting scheme. Instead of one verse clusters spaced by the fibonnaci sequence, we find that this scheme utilizes the number of verse clusters together. Vs 13 is a 1 vs cluster, and so is vs16, then 2 at 18&19, then 3 at vs23to25, then 5 verses at 28to32. If you wanted to continue on past day 7...which the plain text tells you to basically ignore because God rested...then you switch back to verse 1 and count 8...based on the other scheme of counting. Now, starting at vs 34 and counting clockwise on the left half of the circle, we have also one white, then one black, then the 5 white mentioned earlier, then the 2 black of vs26&27 , then 3 white, then 3 black....and we're right back to the enpoint of the first fibonnaci sequence starting from vs1...a 0 point in my opinion created by the two 21x21 squares overlapping at 13 and 21 to form a total of 34 verses. One fibonnaci sequence starts around vs 21 and proceeds upwards to 8 at vs 1 moving ccw. The other starts around vs 13 and moves cw to vs 34. Yet another fibonnaci sequence starts at 34 and moves counter to the last one and in between it to vs 21. And the last or 4th sequence is the one marked in large 1,2,4,7....which is the fibonnaci sequence minus 1. So, every single cluster and spacing of verses based on the unique prime factors is somehow related to the fibonnaci sequence. Quite the coincidence, in my opinion! AND....the fibonnaci sequence moves counter to the fibonnaci sequence in two different directions in 2 different schemas in counting. Quite amazing to me...but it makes my head hurt at times also. So, I understand if you don't see it. Believe me. I do. I rather think I'm destined to be quite alone in admiration of it actually. But I thought I'd try with a few people who think in these terms,...you and Vernon. Haven't had much luck yet, but I appreciate your efforts. I do.

[RockGate]

The numbers in Vernon's website list A, B, and C as simple numbers. It is a very simple algebraic equation of substitution....substitute 500 for A and multiply by 500. I usually represent multiplication by separating the factors to be multiplied by parenthesis rather than an x or *....if I can....that is my preference.

Eg. I could have just written the first equation like this:

500 * phi = (2 * 105) + 99

See? Simple. All first 8 words of the torah are parametrically linked to these 3 numbers, thanks to Vernon Jenkins. I simply am trying to figure out why...and I'm on a good start....it all seems to revolve around the Golden Triangle.

[Richard Amiel McGough]

I looked at your data. Of course, I can't compare my findings, but only for Genesis..since that is all I have in spreadsheet. But my findings from copying your database is 78,070 characters and 20,564 words. What is fascinating to me is that the word count is 52 more than the aishdas.org number. Your total number of characters off for the whole torah is 51. Perhaps a coincidence, don't know. But I'm forced to wonder if there is some kind of Jewish tradition going on here...perhaps with one of the names of God...since it is blasphemy to repeat it....perhaps it is blasphemy to count the letters? Just a wild guess....stab in the dark. The reason I wonder that is because Jhwh is 26 and 26 x 2 is 52. Could this have anything to do with the discrepency in word count?

BTW, I'm totally new to the Torah....could you tell me what BHS is? Thanks.

The BHS is the Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia, which is a standard critical edition of the Massoretic text. There are a few other versions of the Hebrew scriptures with minor variations, but I have not studied them in any detail.

[RockGate]

sqrt1.25 - 0.5 = 0.61803398874989484820458683436564 = PHI = AT HEAVEN / 100

0.5(e(sqrt1.25)) = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 = AT THE HEAVEN / 100
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>


A = 500
B = 105
C = 99

A(PHI) = 2B +C

A(E) = 12B + C

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

(PHI) = (2B +C) / A = sqrt1.25 - 0.5 = 0.61803398874989484820458683436564 = PHI = AT HEAVEN / 100

(E) = (12B + C) / A = 0.5(e(sqrt1.25)) = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 = AT THE HEAVEN / 100

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

e = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)

PHI = sqrt1.25 - 0.5

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A(sqrt1.25 - 0.5) = 2B +C

A(1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)) = 12B + C

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

500(sqrt1.25 - 0.5) = 2(105) + 99

500(1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)) = 12(105) + 99

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>


309.01699437494742410229341718282 ~ 309

1359.1409142295226176801437356761 ~ 1359

[Richard Amiel McGough]

sqrt1.25 - 0.5 = 0.61803398874989484820458683436564 = PHI = AT HEAVEN / 100

0.5(e(sqrt1.25)) = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 = AT THE HEAVEN / 100
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>


A = 500
B = 105
C = 99

A(PHI) = 2B +C

A(E) = 12B + C

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

(PHI) = (2B +C) / A = sqrt1.25 - 0.5 = 0.61803398874989484820458683436564 = PHI = AT HEAVEN / 100

(E) = (12B + C) / A = 0.5(e(sqrt1.25)) = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 = AT THE HEAVEN / 100

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

e = 1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)

PHI = sqrt1.25 - 0.5

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A(sqrt1.25 - 0.5) = 2B +C

A(1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)) = 12B + C

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

500(sqrt1.25 - 0.5) = 2(105) + 99

500(1.5195657376092118891459216468083 / 0.5(sqrt1.25)) = 12(105) + 99

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>


309.01699437494742410229341718282 ~ 309

1359.1409142295226176801437356761 ~ 1359

I don't understand what these numbers are supposed to mean. Why do you think they are significant?